Official Soldat Forums
Soldat Talk => General Discussions => Topic started by: Mistercharles on July 16, 2014, 07:43:54 pm
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THE WARSAW INDIES (http://www.polygon.com/features/2014/7/16/5824384/warsaw-indies-crunching-koalas)
"You know Soldat? I made Soldat. I'm the guy behind Soldat."
Michal Marcinkowski isn't the oldest indie game developer in Poland, but he was the first. Not yet 30 when I meet him in the Crunching Koalas office space, Marcinkowski was in high school when he released the 2-D multiplayer shooter Soldat in 2002. It was his first commercial game, and also, as of yet, his most successful.
"It was a global success," Marcinkowski says. "It was pretty cool. ... I was indie even before [the term] indie was invented. Nobody called me indie until 2008 or something. [Before that] I was just making games."
Yet ever since releasing Soldat, both before and after he came to be called "indie," Marcinkowski has been chasing the success of that very first commercial game — and, so far, failing.
"That's why [I'm] doing a sequel," he says. "It should be even better. ... I want to fix the mistakes. I didn't know what I was doing back then. There was just my intuition and luck. I made lots of decisions that weren't good, especially long term, in terms of weapons patterns and things — I think the game could be more fun if I fix those mistakes."
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As positive as it sounds, I doubt the game he's working on will actually be the Soldat we know. Probably the same concept, but different gameplay. As he says, he wants to fix mistakes, but a lot of what is considered game mechanics in Soldat right now originated from those mistakes and flaws. Kind of how rocket jumping was "invented" in the Quake series. From what I saw with KAG - I got the impression he has no clue what he's doing. The game was functional but they just couldn't decide on the gameplay. So the big question is - which parts of Soldat MM thinks are "mistakes", and which parts make Soldat what it is. I'm skeptical that MM will be able to decide correctly, but oh well. We'll wait and see I guess.
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Is that related to Storm2D (http://www.storm2d.net), or is he talking about a completely new game here?
Rating on what he said there it rather sounds like if it's a new game which is coded by himself, which wouldn't apply to Storm2D, unless MM is actually RolandB, lol.
@L[one]R, yeah, that's indeed hard to get those "mistakes" filtered, if you are the dev and not the player.
I guess that's a problem many game devs have to face, they have another view on the game and on it's potential and "mistakes" or whatever.
That's the point where you should listen to a small team of players, but not too much community driven though.. hard thing to balance out.
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I only skimmed the article, but I'm pretty sure it's not Storm2D he's referring to.
As I can tell from ideas they've been throwing out about it, it sounds more like Link-Dead than Soldat. Think classed based (medics that can revive and resupply ammo, spies and gunner classes), placing mines, repairing stuff.
Though unlike Link-Dead I'm guessing they'll try to make it actually fun and not control like Prince of Persia games.
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It could be Storm2d actually. I dont know of another project atm.
Maybe it is soldat 1.7 renamed soldat 2 ;P
Come on you dont think 1.7 will be awesome?
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that one is storm, but MM wasn't happy with how that interview went; i think he was more happy with how it came out on the site but i wouldn't take everything as gospel
Okey, it's obviously about Storm but it's kinda weird how MM claims here that it's his game and doesnt even mention anything about it. No idea if it's just a bad interviewer and article, but I'm sure he had the chance to clear some things out because the way it's written it says that MM is doing that game.
but .. oh well, you never know.. Link-Dead is lying around for around 3-4 years untouched now, guess it's time to turn it into something good.
For everyone who hasn't heard about Storm2D yet:
storm2d.net (http://www.storm2d.net)
Trailer on YT (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_LQk9y6Ew4)
Shoozza: not unless you reveal some features or post the devlogs in time ! :p
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It could be Storm2d actually. I dont know of another project atm.
For once I'm the one reading Asana and you aren't.
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No idea if it's just a bad interviewer and article
It's more than likely that this is the case. If it was Storm I'd imagine the article would say that MM's team of devs are working on Soldat 2, rather than insinuating MM being the sole developer.
Hell, or maybe MM is secretly making Soldat 2 and hasn't told anyone yet, like how he didn't say anything about KAG for a while.
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It could be Storm2d actually. I dont know of another project atm.
Maybe it is soldat 1.7 renamed soldat 2 ;P
Come on you dont think 1.7 will be awesome?
I'm a lot more hyped by 1.7 than by MM's sequel.
To be honest I don't even care about it. I'm just posting here to give you my support, Shoozza. :)
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It could be Storm2d actually. I dont know of another project atm.
For once I'm the one reading Asana and you aren't.
Awesome! Keep it up! But don't worry I read it a lot as well ;)
No idea if it's just a bad interviewer and article
It's more than likely that this is the case. If it was Storm I'd imagine the article would say that MM's team of devs are working on Soldat 2, rather than insinuating MM being the sole developer.
Hell, or maybe MM is secretly making Soldat 2 and hasn't told anyone yet, like how he didn't say anything about KAG for a while.
Or maybe he didn't say it like they wrote is and it is a big misunderstanding. Mysterious!
It could be Storm2d actually. I dont know of another project atm.
Maybe it is soldat 1.7 renamed soldat 2 ;P
Come on you dont think 1.7 will be awesome?
I'm a lot more hyped by 1.7 than by MM's sequel.
To be honest I don't even care about it. I'm just posting here to give you my support, Shoozza. :)
Thanks for the support! Please support the other devs as well, they also need some boost to get thought the soldat code jungle of chaos with all the deep if wholes, the 80+ char high line trees and the 25k+ line high file mountains of madness with their hill functions which also grow some hundreds of lines up.
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Thanks for the support! Please support the other devs as well, they also need some boost to get thought the soldat code jungle of chaos with all the deep if wholes, the 80+ char high line trees and the 25k+ line high file mountains of madness with their hill functions which also grow some hundreds of lines up.
I blame a lot of the code's "inelegance" on the fact that it's written in Delphi more than anything else.
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aw EFF i'd kill to see the soldat source code
like
f, man
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Heh on the other hand it is still source code and while I describe it like an adventure it is one of a different kind ;)
Thanks for the support! Please support the other devs as well, they also need some boost to get thought the soldat code jungle of chaos with all the deep if wholes, the 80+ char high line trees and the 25k+ line high file mountains of madness with their hill functions which also grow some hundreds of lines up.
I blame a lot of the code's "inelegance" on the fact that it's written in Delphi more than anything else.
I have to disagree, I blame the "inelegance" on taking shortcuts and other stuff which is not language related (splitting it in two repositories, huge non modular files etc).
You can write inelegant code any language (some languages make it more difficult though - functional ones mainly). I don't want think about how ugly the code would look like if it was written in a more popular compiled language.
Without Delphi there would be no Soldat.
Delphi is easy to understand and has less traps loop holes. It was actually developed for teaching purposes.
So what is the reason you think it is inelegant? Is it because Delphi requires you to declare variables in the function head?
I notice this is going offtopic so maybe we should split this into another thread :3
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Heh on the other hand it is still source code and while I describe it like an adventure it is one of a different kind ;)
Thanks for the support! Please support the other devs as well, they also need some boost to get thought the soldat code jungle of chaos with all the deep if wholes, the 80+ char high line trees and the 25k+ line high file mountains of madness with their hill functions which also grow some hundreds of lines up.
I blame a lot of the code's "inelegance" on the fact that it's written in Delphi more than anything else.
I have to disagree, I blame the "inelegance" on taking shortcuts and other stuff which is not language related (splitting it in two repositories, huge non modular files etc).
You can write inelegant code any language (some languages make it more difficult though - functional ones mainly). I don't want think about how ugly the code would look like if it was written in a more popular compiled language.
Without Delphi there would be no Soldat.
Delphi is easy to understand and has less traps loop holes. It was actually developed for teaching purposes.
So what is the reason you think it is inelegant? Is it because Delphi requires you to declare variables in the function head?
I notice this is going offtopic so maybe we should split this into another thread :3
I don't care about defining variables in the function thread and there are a few things I like about it, except I think it's kind of messed up how instead of using braces or indention it makes you litter your code with then/begin/end, assignment requires a colon before the equals sign, and delphi has very strange syntax highlighting. There are other things as well but I'd rather whine to you over gtalk than the forums ;)
That, and just because something was created for teaching doesn't mean it's a good or bad thing in itself.
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It could be Storm2d actually. I dont know of another project atm.
Maybe it is soldat 1.7 renamed soldat 2 ;P
Come on you dont think 1.7 will be awesome?
Sure I do :)
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Ok, If there were Soldat 2, this is what the fan want for years:
- New GUI
- 2.5D with parallax effect map
- HD graphic and texture
- Shadow and light effect
- More ''bonus'' item
- More live (smoking, bird flying, trees sway)
- Character preview in ''player'' tab
- Remove ''Pointmatch'' :X
- Dynamic sound effects in diffirent enviroment
- Better Movement
- Compeletely brand new maps (or remake)
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- CAMPAAAAAIGN... !!!!!
Well I have collected the fan idea, this is what they want most. :)
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Ok, If there were Soldat 2, this is what the fan want for years:
You forgot vehicles (http://static-cdn.jtvnw.net/jtv_user_pictures/chansub-global-emoticon-ddc6e3a8732cb50f-25x28.png)
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Don't worry Shoozza we are all waiting impatiently for 1.7 and if you keep up with the devlogs you will hopefully cause more excitement :) Though I am interested to see where Storm2d goes I have tried the alpha and read a bit in their forums, currently it feels that they do not really have a clear idea of what sort of gameplay they want the game to focus on but it is only in the alpha stages so guess we will see!
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Ok, If there were Soldat 2, this is what the fan want for years:
- New GUI
- 2.5D with parallax effect map
- HD graphic and texture
- Shadow and light effect
- More ''bonus'' item
- More live (smoking, bird flying, trees sway)
- Character preview in ''player'' tab
- Remove ''Pointmatch'' :X
- Dynamic sound effects in diffirent enviroment
- Better Movement
- Compeletely brand new maps (or remake)
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- CAMPAAAAAIGN... !!!!!
Well I have collected the fan idea, this is what they want most. :)
Just give us a decent performance. [pigtail]
For me, the 30 fps (or less) feeling in the "newest PCs" killed the game.
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You forgot vehicles (http://static-cdn.jtvnw.net/jtv_user_pictures/chansub-global-emoticon-ddc6e3a8732cb50f-25x28.png)
Yeah, vehicles can smash the enemy :) like a tank :)
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This game definitely needs heavy optimization and should be considered if possible in the next version(s)
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It could be Storm2d actually. I dont know of another project atm.
Maybe it is soldat 1.7 renamed soldat 2 ;P
Come on you dont think 1.7 will be awesome?
Are planned changes available for read somewhere?
Also, first post in 5 years. lel
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We have an idea what has to be changed for 1.7 but it's not public.
It would be nice if we could surprise the community.
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^ I don't know if I should be afraid or not.
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^ I don't know if I should be afraid or not.
I remember being afraid of every new patch since the patches that came after 1.2.1.
Not much kept stuck in my head, but the number 1.2.1 for some reason kept stuck in my head as the pretty much best Soldat version (IMO, anyways, in the opinion of many others too.). The patches after that made me traumatized of patches. :(
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Keep it a darn secret! for once
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^ I don't know if I should be afraid or not.
Trust me, we should be afraid. We are so small community that I don't see any point of keeping secrets. NO MORE SECRETS!
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I'm gonna translate what Moroe and Kicikici meant:
Don't remove or break movement stuffs, skoskav.
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^ +1
but I am much worried about other stuff like polygons (tries of "fix" polybugs, which were mentioned somewhere not so long ago).
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Jumping is already broken :C
(http://i.imgur.com/OnvjONI.gif)
Fixerino plix
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^ +1
but I am much worried about other stuff like polygons (tries of "fix" polybugs, which were mentioned somewhere not so long ago).
That too.
If you guys try to fix polybugs, there are so many side effects that could potentially happen and ruin the movement versatility of the game.
For example breaking of the wall jump and polyboost mechanics. Which for me would be an instant lost of interest for the game.
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Jumping is already broken :C
(http://i.imgur.com/OnvjONI.gif)
Fixerino plix
I take it you're talking about the way it's hard to jump away from a slope you are climbing in this version when you are facing away from it?
I must say that It still happens often to me. I think it's something worth looking into. Hoping the fix is trivial.
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Ye, http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=43029.60 (http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=43029.60) this topic exactly - it was smoother back in 1.6.5 - talking about the issue you described
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It could be Storm2d actually. I dont know of another project atm.
Maybe it is soldat 1.7 renamed soldat 2 ;P
Come on you dont think 1.7 will be awesome?
I'm a lot more hyped by 1.7 than by MM's sequel.
To be honest I don't even care about it. I'm just posting here to give you my support, Shoozza. :)
I am with you in this one. Who cares for some shitty ripoff, soldat is just a special thing. I will always follow the scene, even though I have become pretty inactive for the last months. But there will always be a comeback! 8)
I must say that It still happens often to me. I think it's something worth looking into. Hoping the fix is trivial.
Sorry, but it is a dangerous thing to expect a fix to be trivial. This doesn't sound like an easy thing to fix.
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To be perfectly honest, whatever we get will be cool. If we get Soldat 2, that'll be cool.
People need to chill out for a minute and realize that if he is making a sequel, that means more possibilities.
Whatever the case, I'm excited.
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fixing mistakes in the engine or something is the same as making a boring version of soldat, cuz every1 wasted like years mastering those bug-features that make all the difference in filtering elder players from the rookers
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^ I don't know if I should be afraid or not.
I remember being afraid of every new patch since the patches that came after 1.2.1.
Not much kept stuck in my head, but the number 1.2.1 for some reason kept stuck in my head as the pretty much best Soldat version (IMO, anyways, in the opinion of many others too.). The patches after that made me traumatized of patches. :(
Well, hands down; IMO 1.2.1 was the best version, after that only a few things were good. Weapon balance sucks nowadays.
I played Storm2D, i didn't like it, the player movements are erratic and confusing; they are not smooth like soldat. The only good thing is the graphic engine.
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omg i just tried storm2d it sucks deep movements are so bad and animation of moving in air looks like.... wtf! only graphics and sound are ok but also no players lol?its not like soldat.... we need some graphics and sound change....
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It's like saying your new house is cold even though you've just started building it.
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He has a point though. It seems like the movement mechanics are not a priority for the developers when you see how much advanced they are already in many other aspects.
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didnt know it was a beta(is it?) besides, Fx just said the same thing as i did and no1 told him "Take your keyboard out of your ass and go to sleep."
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didnt know it was a beta(is it?) besides, Fx just said the same thing as i did and no1 told him "Take your keyboard out of your ass and go to sleep."
The difference is, Fx basically said "I don't like this game because this and this", you said "L0L dis gaem SUx cuz dis sux and dis sux". Fx clearly stated that it is his opinion, and that HE just doesn't like the game. Also his grammar isn't nearly as bad as yours. You were just screaming how much the game sucks, without really explaining why.
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is any1 here a Dev of strorm2d? if so then im sorry if i insulted any1...
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its supposed success are on the community efforts alone, specially those highly dedicated guys and all. Its tots unfair to say MM has much (or anything, since he just got too scared to meddle up) to do with it, but community will never be mentioned anywhere, and now MM will just make another Soldat? Cmon he should have done it 5 years ago, now Soldat-style is gone.....
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Why does he even still try with other stuff? It is horrible to watch him desperately trying to recreate the success he had with soldat with another game. It wont work.
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Why does he even still try with other stuff? It is horrible to watch him desperately trying to recreate the success he had with soldat with another game. It wont work.
I can't say I agree here. KAG is probably just as successful as Soldat was in the beginning.
Sure he failed horribly with Crimson Glory and Linked-Dead and a few others but KAG definitely was worth it.
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Why does he even still try with other stuff? It is horrible to watch him desperately trying to recreate the success he had with soldat with another game. It wont work.
I can't say I agree here. KAG is probably just as successful as Soldat was in the beginning.
Sure he failed horribly with Crimson Glory and Linked-Dead and a few others but KAG definitely was worth it.
He isn't really working on KAG anymore though, is he? It's mostly Geti and a bunch of others, but even then I get the impression they have to clue what they're doing. They keep rewriting and remaking stuff, making drastic balance changes only to scrap them later and go entirely different way; adding game modes, mechanics and features that have seemingly no synergy with each other (complex building and mechanisms in a fast-paced action game where stuff gets destroyed far faster than it gets built for example). It may be reasonably successful now, but I don't expect it to get much further.
Storm 2D perhaps shows the most promise, but even then it's still very early in development and there's much that can happen to lead it astray.
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Storm 2D perhaps shows the most promise, but even then it's still very early in development and there's much that can happen to lead it astray.
They have a few other games currently in dev (that are based off of KAG's codebase) that I probably can't talk about but look awesome so far.
THD is by no means stagnant and MM makes these games as his fulltime job, and he continually hires more game devs / random people to work for him on newer projects.
MM likes to iterate very fast. When you have that mindset you can't spend all your waking time on your decade-old project that got you into the business, especially not after delegating its management and development to someone else (Shoozza)
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still waiting for those teaser-trailers for 1.7
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still waiting for those teaser-trailers for 1.7
Just play one of your current demos with some background music xD
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Ok, If there were Soldat 2, this is what the fan want for years:
- New GUI
- 2.5D with parallax effect map
- HD graphic and texture
- Shadow and light effect
- More ''bonus'' item
- More live (smoking, bird flying, trees sway)
- Character preview in ''player'' tab
- Remove ''Pointmatch'' :X
- Dynamic sound effects in diffirent enviroment
- Better Movement
- Compeletely brand new maps (or remake)
-
-
- CAMPAAAAAIGN... !!!!!
Well I have collected the fan idea, this is what they want most. :)
We already did have that. It worked great though, so I guess you're not the one to adress.