So now you dont mind if map "have too much" sceneries?Since you've made a couple of fair points in here:
Any idea when you release updated Polywork to play with it a bit(even without actual game to test it)?
As I see there is still no news in terms of graphic use in it, just one graphic file that need to be stretched to fit map(no multi-texturing)?
Also yeah, gostek look now like some sticker on screen, its too small and too "sharp" compared to map style. It would be good to check and see how game would look if gostek would be slightly bigger(2-5%) so it could contain ""more"" shading(and less contour). Just to see how it would work in game.
Wow! It looks nice :o Soldat needs a change like this.There's no point in talking about a release date yet since nobody knows how much activity there will be, but I hope the new look will inspire more people to contribute
BTW. Any details about 1.8 ? Release date (approximately) or something?
It's genuinely awesome. Sincere thanks for all the work.
I have one small criticism: to me, the player models look as if they're *behind* the terrain, as if the ground they are walking on is much much closer to us than the player model itself. At times. Like shown below.
(http://image.prntscr.com/image/695573e96dd6402aad90831ae52e7571.png)
(Probably largely because the new lighting and whatnot aren't applied to player models? Perhaps this is okay and I'm just wrong, you'd know better. Just thought I'd share.)
Thanks again! It looks excellent.
If you're going to put the art into high res, then you're going to heavily need to redo the gostek animations because high res art is going to reveal how "clumsy" the animations are to newer players and potentially turn them off from the game.Indeed, I've done small changes to gostek positioning to try and hide most of the flaws, but they are still there because the animations are fundamentally flawed. We hope to redo the system after 1.8, it's too big of a task for now. Gosteks do indeed look a little flat as well, which we hope to improve at the same time. You can check out the guy on the chair in blue base for a vague idea how we envision the future gosteks ;)
The trick to Soldat's """"ugly"""" art style was it was imaginative. MM didn't have to work hard on the animations because the player could fill in the blanks as to what was happening because the low res would be beneficial and blend sprites together. With high resolution, I feel like its gonna look weird to see a player rotate his arms to throw a grenade, or oscillate his legs when walking forward.
I've only seen screenshots so correct me if you've already improved the animations, but I think if you're going to gut the art style, you're going to have to change the other aesthetics of the game as well.
I'm glad you are still updating, those are just my thoughts as a retired loyal player and a fellow developer who made his own game heavily inspired by Soldat.
I think changing the art destroys an essential part of the original game, I played for the simple pixel graphics and beautiful UI. Michal is still out there intentionally making pixel games met with even better success, I don't think downgrading the aesthetic is going to restore the player base to what it once was.
Monsteri
Soldat Beta Team
Beautiful work. Unfortunately there's a ugly HUD to make your art worse.We will reduce official map list to ~ 15 per game mode, mb. More maybe less, depending on progress.
Are you going to cover all the 287382732 maps with your design?
We will reduce official map list to ~ 15 per game mode, mb. More maybe less, depending on progress.amen
There's already a new official map pool, which will be released *somewhen*.
I guess the HUD will be touched as well, at some point in the future.
The goals of the new art direction are a cohesive style, much improved visuals, and improved readability of the game elements.Does the focus on game elements mean the looks/style of the menu system is going to be left mostly untouched for 1.8?
QuoteThe goals of the new art direction are a cohesive style, much improved visuals, and improved readability of the game elements.Does the focus on game elements mean the looks/style of the menu system is going to be left mostly untouched for 1.8?
This will be soooooo gooood with a 144 hertz screen. I'm just going to run around and look at the maps to begin with..!Combined with a good graphics card you can use for antialiasing and stuff you're gonna be soo happy ;)
Thank you for inviting us to share our thoughts. Here are mine...
You are ugly and have been since creation. Soldat (pre 1.7.0) is gorgeous.
I don't get why all these guys are boning Monsteri for having produced something which a ten year old could have done within 30 minutes on MS paint.Be our guest! Create Mockup of ONE MAP in MS paint! Or at least part of it! C'mon! Or you just like talking?
One can easily change the look of Soldat by using mods. This is essentially what you are. Modders. Not creators/developers.
Many, many Soldat maps are genius in design and absolutely should be preserved in their original form.
gamebreaking bugs have been in this game for years and nothing really changedWhat game breaking bugs?
visual improvements will not really bring a new activity if the game is still in the state as it was 10 years ago
just my unpopular and unpleased opinion, peace
The soldiers really need a complete rework.What would you like them to be like precisely? I don't think there's much that can be changed due to the magnitudes. Imo it's fine.
I don't think it's necessary to stick to the traditional gostek "theme".
Hi guysMost likely, yes, unless some calamity happens.
1.8 version will be released this year?
LOL u guys are really really funny if u think remaking few maps will change anything , u guys are nothing but just fucking nerds talking on forums, join fucking irc #soldat and try to play some games u will see that SOLDAT IS DEAD .. shit u drivin me crazy guys.. u r not even playing just talking shits on forums for years, do you fucking understand it wont help? god... fucking unbelieveable... shit im just gonna commit suicide cyaI would be playing if the wm wasn't so botched.
Yes I also do not want to play because the dar dar broke weapom modLOL u guys are really really funny if u think remaking few maps will change anything , u guys are nothing but just fucking nerds talking on forums, join fucking irc #soldat and try to play some games u will see that SOLDAT IS DEAD .. shit u drivin me crazy guys.. u r not even playing just talking shits on forums for years, do you fucking understand it wont help? god... fucking unbelieveable... shit im just gonna commit suicide cyaI would be playing if the wm wasn't so botched.
And dardar rather have the game die than to add the servers with my wm onto his gather bot.
@RBK there is a discord chat now, which means split community when it comes to chat. https://discord.gg/YZzEn9YI did, or I made a wm that was great, and Azwraith hosted them on his server.
@ginn Btw you can host your own servers with your own wm, not sure if it will help much though.
join fucking irc #soldatbro why u need all that fancy stuff when u can just click on soldat icon then get some servers and have your fun...
about the "wm" at this point no one really cares about that shit (unless u have OCD).. u fire u die u respawn its the same. it aint like u will have more fun if u have few more bullets xDIf you played the game at a high level it's day and night. The difference now is around 15-20% more damage than it used to be, so you die 15-20% faster than you used to.
and now that i think a bit ... its actually really cool that the games wm changes constantly givin it a new feelin on each iteration...
[Desert Eagles]
Damage=1.65
FireInterval=24
Ammo=7
ReloadTime=70
Speed=19
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0.0
BulletSpread=0.0
Recoil=0
Push=0.0176
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.0
ModifierChest=1.0
ModifierLegs=1.0
[HK MP5]
Damage=0.905
FireInterval=6
Ammo=32
ReloadTime=105
Speed=18.9
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0.09
Recoil=0
Push=0.0112
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.0
ModifierChest=1.0
ModifierLegs=1.0
[Ak-74]
Damage=0.95
FireInterval=12
Ammo=30
ReloadTime=165
Speed=27
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.01615
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.1
ModifierChest=0.95
ModifierLegs=0.95
[Steyr AUG]
Damage=0.615
FireInterval=7
Ammo=30
ReloadTime=125
Speed=26
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.006
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.254
ModifierChest=0.95
ModifierLegs=0.95
[Spas-12]
Damage=1.05
FireInterval=34
Ammo=7
ReloadTime=165
Speed=14
BulletStyle=3
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0.8
Recoil=0
Push=0.015
InheritedVelocity=0.588
ModifierHead=1.0
ModifierChest=1.0
ModifierLegs=1.0
[Ruger 77]
Damage=2.185
FireInterval=42
Ammo=4
ReloadTime=90
Speed=33
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=12
MovementAcc=0.0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.012
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.245
ModifierChest=0.84
ModifierLegs=0.84
[M79]
Damage=1550
FireInterval=6
Ammo=1
ReloadTime=178
Speed=10.7
BulletStyle=4
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.036
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1
ModifierChest=1
ModifierLegs=1
[Barret M82A1]
Damage=4.45
FireInterval=180
Ammo=10
ReloadTime=70
Speed=55
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=19
Bink=65
MovementAcc=0.05
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.018
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.0
ModifierChest=1.0
ModifierLegs=1.0
[FN Minimi]
Damage=0.82
FireInterval=9
Ammo=50
ReloadTime=250
Speed=24.6
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.015136
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.1
ModifierChest=0.95
ModifierLegs=0.95
[XM214 Minigun]
Damage=0.333
FireInterval=3
Ammo=100
ReloadTime=360
Speed=29
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=15
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0.0
BulletSpread=0.3
Recoil=0
Push=0.0104
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.1
ModifierChest=0.95
ModifierLegs=0.85
[USSOCOM]
Damage=1.15
FireInterval=10
Ammo=12
ReloadTime=60
Speed=19
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.02
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.1
ModifierChest=0.95
ModifierLegs=0.95
[Combat Knife]
Damage=2150
FireInterval=6
Ammo=1
ReloadTime=3
Speed=6
BulletStyle=11
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.12
InheritedVelocity=0
ModifierHead=1.15
ModifierChest=1
ModifierLegs=0.9
[Chainsaw]
Damage=50
FireInterval=2
Ammo=200
ReloadTime=110
Speed=8
BulletStyle=11
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.0028
InheritedVelocity=0
ModifierHead=1.15
ModifierChest=1.0
ModifierLegs=0.9
[M72 LAW]
Damage=1550
FireInterval=6
Ammo=1
ReloadTime=300
Speed=23
BulletStyle=12
StartUpTime=13
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.028
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.15
ModifierChest=1.0
ModifierLegs=0.9
[Punch]
Damage=330
FireInterval=6
Ammo=1
ReloadTime=3
Speed=5
BulletStyle=6
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0
InheritedVelocity=0
ModifierHead=1.15
ModifierChest=1
ModifierLegs=0.9
[Grenade]
Damage=1500
FireInterval=80
Ammo=1
ReloadTime=20
Speed=5
BulletStyle=2
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0
InheritedVelocity=1
ModifierHead=1.0
ModifierChest=1.0
ModifierLegs=1.0
[Stationary Gun]
Damage=1.8
FireInterval=10
Ammo=100
ReloadTime=366
Speed=36
BulletStyle=14
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.0088
InheritedVelocity=0
ModifierHead=1.1
ModifierChest=0.95
ModifierLegs=0.85
[Flamer]
Damage=19
FireInterval=6
Ammo=200
ReloadTime=5
Speed=10.5
BulletStyle=5
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.016
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.15
ModifierChest=1
ModifierLegs=0.9
[Rambo Bow]
Damage=12
FireInterval=10
Ammo=1
ReloadTime=25
Speed=21
BulletStyle=7
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0.0148
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.15
ModifierChest=1
ModifierLegs=0.9
[Flamed Arrows]
Damage=8
FireInterval=10
Ammo=1
ReloadTime=39
Speed=18
BulletStyle=8
StartUpTime=0
Bink=0
MovementAcc=0
BulletSpread=0
Recoil=0
Push=0
InheritedVelocity=0.5
ModifierHead=1.15
ModifierChest=1
ModifierLegs=0.9
and to be honest 3v3 organized "ego" matches are not fun at all compared to full blown 6v6 randomness over 90000 matches ..just sayin
that folks could "gather" at publics and it would be a lot more fun for everyone
just imagine the bizarre kick wars and all that jazz cuz some cheaterz joined and shit
Petter, play with us (read: me) in OneShots a bit and I bet you'll be singing a different tuneBruh... It would make some sense if you asked me to do it, since I'm not a prevailing 1v1 player (although I do have a pretty good brt)
-snip-Sure, it's important to pay attention to publics when the game launches to steam, and to have some cool vfx and sfx, and maybe bit servers and maps.
The Pubs' games might be more "wet and wild" than games between the experts, which are usually more controlled and refined.Even the competitive scene can be "wet and wild". There's always new things that radically changes the way the game is played. Like m79 boosting, flag throwing (including super throw, although being banned immediately), a brief dip into movement, and then a huge shift into movement.
Not really comparable/relevant, as those 1v1 tournaments include autos, as opposed to only one shot weaponsPetter, play with us (read: me) in OneShots a bit and I bet you'll be singing a different tuneBruh... It would make some sense if you asked me to do it, since I'm not a prevailing 1v1 player (although I do have a pretty good brt)
I'm pretty sure Petter has won most of the 1v1 tournaments, which afaik has a lot of barrettards.
Though, I think the new WM has pretty much shut down everything, making some weapons completely useless. Combining that with meds and nade kits not spawning properly, you'll never see people defending, because it's just not possible to play that way.
>Often times it is both about reading and reacting to your opponent.No, it's not. Since the TTK is so low, all you have to do is spray or "aim" in the direction and you get the kill.>So honestly I don't see why it would come as a surprise to people that it is a little more offensively focused.I'm very "offensivly focused", and the game is just really bad now. It's really not that "offensive", it's just brute force. You throw bodies until one lucks out with lag and get a cap, that's really what makes the difference now. Tactics are gone.>there were just too many newcomers that absolutely loved this game but left it several times due to the insanely high TTK.Then they didn't love the game, did they? If they thought the TTK was too long they could play realistic. Or a server with a weapons mod.>as any 1v2+ will almost undoubtedly result in the 2+ players finishing off the single person.With a high TTK yes, that's true.
You know why that's good? Because that means teamwork is highly important. With proper position, and catching other players off posisiton, that may mean you can actually win that 2v1. It meas better strategy and tactics, with better teamwork wins.
With this low TTK it means that it really comes down to eats. You ate a nade, so now you freely get that 1v2 win, and you get the cap.>Yes, some unexperienced newbie could occasionally take out the better opponent, but it was a very niche, and this shouldn't be a crucial part of the metagame. Currently, for a newbie the skill gap is not that huge, which is a good thing.Somehow you believe it's a bad thing that skilled players dominate unskilled players... I really don't understand you. This is why you should never have been in the beta team, and why you really shouldn't have any say in anything about soldat.
Newbies don't play with veterans, it's never going to happen. Veteran players will not find any enjoyment to play against newbies, and newbies won't find it fun to play against veterans. Making the skills a veteran has obtained pointless will just make the veteran player quit the game.>We shouldn't be aiming for a WM that succesfully eliminates the importance of aim and leaves movement abilities as the only differentiating factor between players because we already had it and it was a borefest for any new player.That's what's been happening though, spread, and low TTK. Basically, aim doesn't matter that much anymore.
Movement SHOULD play a huge role, so should should aim, positioning, strategy, and being able to read the game flow.
At the moment, the only thing that matters is to have a bit better aim, and eat more, more or less at least.>I don't think the upcoming big 1.8 version will catch on with any WM with decreased damage because it's defensive nature will likely render it a game that is not fun to watch.And with that the game completely dies, no newbies will really play it, and veterans will completely drop the game.>Now you may claim that the current WM is indeed good for a newcomer, but very bad for vets whose experience has been vanished. No, not at all. Skill and knowledge pays off over damage aka sprey and pray.You sound like you're trying to tell the working class that it's a good thing they pay as much taxes as those who make 100 fold their salary.
The WM is bad for everyone. Every newbie still just play barrett and m79, and pros are left with a horribly bad WM.
>Tactic is still a factor, and in cases where the players are otherwise close to, or totally equal, can thus be a determining factorIt's not.
There are no tactics anymore. The only tactic is "LETS SMASH THEM AT UP INSTEAD OF MID!!!!".
There's no med pack and nades stealing, there's no defense that requires proper positioning, there's just no tactics involved at all. It's just rushing and hope you get a double kill and eat some nades so you can boost out with the flag.>So the tactic and skill still makes the difference in the outcomeAs I've said... No, the difference in the outcome is lag, primarily. Whichever side gets the more important eats wins.>If you took someone with excellent strategy, but average aim and dodging ability, and placed them against someone with excellent aim and dodging ability, but average strategy, who do you think the result would favour?The person with excellent aim and dodging ability would win 10-0. Strategy and tactics are dead.
I'm very much into strategy and tactics in this game, it was one of the things I loved the most... There's a reason we could get out wins with only 2/3rds (like 70vs110 kills) of the kills of the opponents was because of movement and strategy ( https://youtu.be/dYKYD1YITZ0?t=2m18s (2min 18s) you think these law shots were a fluke? These were practiced, to time the law travel time for capper to be able to take flag as it drops... I did this both with PR and /MB/).
I was even the only person in the top 10 with a K/D below 0.9, the next ranked player with such a low K/D was below top 50 (Even lesonen had a higher K/D).>I tend to think it's obvious enough, and this highlights my point; strategy is STILL a more major factor in determining who wins in one case than another.No? It completely failed it? Reading through it, I was pretty sure you'd say that aim and dodging is the determining factor.
Strategy and tactics has no place in soldat at the moment, and probably never more.>And therefore i do believe that this is the right way of developing the WM. Yes it boils down to "click the other guy before he clicks me" but we need that now for the playerbase to grow.You believe the best way to make a wm is to eliminate tactics, strategy, movement, and aim... Because you want veterans and newbies to be on the same skill cieling. You're practically suggesting that CS would be better if NGEV had AWP dmg.>Low TTK means that the game becomes powerful as players have little chance to react. Magazine size matters less, as you can kill enough targets in a single magazine. Spray&pray become more important than accurate firing because lucky hits can net you a kill already, meaning sprey weapons are overall the best to mow down enemies.Yes, low TTK means that there's less skill invovled, it's just mindless killing... Like DM, which you so much like.
That's not a good thing.>This is the type of gameplay we should stick to to make everyone, ESPECIALLY THE NEWCOMERS, feel powerful, as anyone can get lucky and accidentally murder a few dudes. Does it vanish the experience? No, not at all as i explained above.Why don't we just make official aimbots? So newcomers can feel powerful.
Newbies playing other newbies will occasionally feel powerful no matter the WM.
Chapter 1
Good players vs The Pubs
[Too much bullshit...]
Chapter 2
The current WM is very good for the game to progress
[Too much bullshit...]
Somehow you believe it's a bad thing that skilled players dominate unskilled playersI never said that. I am not saying that higher skill players don't dominate, what I'm saying is that with the current WM the conditions for success are much easier to attain for beginners. Skilled players will always have an advantage in any WM system over unskilled players. Indeed they have a slightly higher advantage in high TTK systems, which you promote so much, because the effects of randomness and surprise are reduced. I also agree with you that with a low TTK a given player is much more instrumental to a team's success than the team as a whole. The game is about reactions and predictability, which is again a good thing in my eyes. Let's go through it:
Due to low ttk strategy and tactics has no place in soldat at the moment, and probably never more. there's just no tactics involved at all. It's just rushing and hope you get a double kill and eat some nades so you can boost out with the flag.I understand the point you're trying to make, but you're exaggerating. Counter-Strike has one of the fastest TTK of any FPS and proves otherwise. What would you say are some of the most skillful games from both of those categories(high and low TTK)? I'm having some trouble thinking of the best high ttk games. They seem to be fairly uncommon these days because they are not fun to watch due to high TTK being very frustrating for everyone involved as it's too easy for players to call in backup. 2 on 1s usually look horrendously bad in a high TTK game, while in a short TTK game you can still maneuver and use skill to kill both enemies. And please don't bring up eats in here because eats do happen in Soldat indeed, but do it happen consistently to the same person? Probably not so in the long term, skill and knowledge pays off over luck. Luck do exist in every game. Randomness benefits a particular player on some occasions and other players on other occasions but in the long run, during the entire match randomness doesn't favor anyone. Everyone will get lucky and unlucky, but the better players will always end up taking a lead. One lucky situation will never be the determinant of the final outcome. There are many other factors that make a greater contribution to the final result.