MP5 vs Steyr Aug

[STM1993]

The current MP5 and Steyr Aug are actually pretty debatable guns when compared to each other.

The current MP5:
Damage=102
FireInterval=6
Ammo=30
ReloadTime=105
Speed=189
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=-11
MovementAcc=1
Recoil=0

The current Steyr Aug:
Damage=73
FireInterval=7
Ammo=30
ReloadTime=115
Speed=260
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=-22
MovementAcc=2
Recoil=0

Theoretically, the MP5 is superior to the Aug, because it has:
1. More damage per shot at close range
2. Faster firing rate and much greater DOT
3. Faster reload
4. No movementacc and very low and controllable self-bink
5. Low bullet speed allows for curved shots.

However, the Aug has ultimately proved to be superior in practical terms. Why?
1. The MP5's low bullet speed means it not only has short range, but it also loses a lot of damage if the bullets were to travel far. On the other hand, the Aug has high bullet speed, which means it is better at a long range and its bullets lose a lot less damage overtime.

2. The Steyr Aug's bullet push is actually superior to the MP5, especially with the Aug's range.

3. The Steyr Aug is actually pretty accurate when used properly by firing in bursts. The MP5, on the other hand, will tend to spray up and down very often even when self-bink has not occurred yet. This is only nullified when the MP5 is used when proning, whereby the bullet flies very accurately. Then again, the Aug can do the same.

4. The Aug's reload is not very much slower than the MP5 - just 10 ticks + 1 fireinterval slower. It's still short enough to reload in heated situations.

5. The MP5 actually eats ammo a lot faster than the Aug, and would typically need to reload after killing one opponent. The Aug can still kill a second person on some occasions, or at least more frequently than the MP5 being able to kill a second opponent.

Therefore, the Aug is often seen as superior to the MP5, and hence the MP5 is being overshadowed by the Aug.



Now, let's look back at the older stats of the MP5.

[1.3.0]
Damage=108
FireInterval=6
Ammo=30
ReloadTime=95
Speed=190
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=-25
MovementAcc=1
Recoil=0

[1.3.1]
Damage=104
FireInterval=6
Ammo=30
ReloadTime=95
Speed=189
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=-25
MovementAcc=1
Recoil=0

(Note: In 1.3.0 and 1.3.1, the Steyr Aug is not any different from what it is now except that it has higher self-bink (-35 and -33 respectively) and no movementacc)

As you can see, the MP5 back then was very powerful, in fact overpowered. It had very strong firepower and a faster reload, and the +1 speed which makes a small difference to damage and a bit on optimum range, though the curve is still relatively the same, though on the negative side, it had very high self-bink.

However, the MP5 was greatly favoured over the Aug by some people back then. This is because the MP5 had some strong edges over the Aug. It had far stronger firepower and the difference in reload time is more significant. In terms of self-bink, it was quite easy to control the MP5's self-bink. If you compare the old MP5 to the Minimi back then, the Minimi was stronger because it had higher firepower (which was overpowered), but if you compare the old MP5 to the current Minimi, their DOT rival each other at optimum range.

I believe that the MP5 could use an increase in firepower, one way or another, without affecting its curve (not more than +1 speed or less than current value if speed is changed). It should have a better ammo advantage over the Aug (which may be indirectly done by tweaking the Aug's ammo/reload). Self-bink depends on how the Aug goes in future, but currently the value shouldn't be changed.

The 75% bullet push would be implemented in 1.5. This reduces both the capabilities of the MP5 and the Aug, but it would actually give the MP5 a slight edge over the Aug, since it would be more difficult for the Aug's long range and bullet push to prevent enemies from approaching the Aug. Unfortunately, how much the 75% bullet push affects the guns, it is still theoretical.

[LtKillroy]

I like a buff to the MP5 it is still my favorite due to the 1.3 days and it is a lot of fun to use and is my weapon of choice for alpha team infiltration. Like you said, the AUG is better in most situations, however. The new version may or may not fix these problems, and I like yours quite a bit.

[Ziem]

Steyr > Mp5, but I still prefer playing mp5 on many maps because it's better in close range ... and I don't expect to kill with it easily on maps like Run or B2b.

Also, in close-mid range it's easy to kill 2 people with any weapon except 1 hits (because of nades).

Steyr's dmg won't be probably changed to prevent the situation where Ak will be just ... better in every situation. I don't like ammo tweaks, but it looks like its the only way to nerf it - but in my opinion Steyr shouldn't be nefred, its just other weapons which should be buffed.

[scarface09]

Mp5 > Steyr...

[croat1gamer]

well, mp5 and steyr are each better in some other situation, but i dont see too much steyr users, i think i see more mp5 users

and something more, the steyr is one from a few rare weapons that can win against a skilled minimi user just by smart usage of cover

[Ziem]

Mp5 > Steyr...

well, mp5 and steyr are each better in some other situation, but i dont see too much steyr users, i think i see more mp5 users

http://nopaste.biz/37000
http://nopaste.biz/37001
http://nopaste.biz/37002

[STM1993]

^ Tada, this actually shows the number of Aug-users compared to MP5-users, or all other weapons for the matter. This also shows that the Aug is more reliable in many situations, strangely perhaps even more versatile than the AK. Now that's definitely a problem.

Steyr's dmg won't be probably changed to prevent the situation where Ak will be just ... better in every situation. I don't like ammo tweaks, but it looks like its the only way to nerf it - but in my opinion Steyr shouldn't be nefred, its just other weapons which should be buffed.

I believe the Aug's DPS, DOT and bullet speed/range are perfectly fine. Those shouldn't be tweaked, for that is what the Aug is.

Accuracy-wise, I think it's pretty much fine, though it could be tweaked to a certain extent. Adjusting the movementacc is a good way to adjust a fast-firing auto's accuracy, but I believe that giving the Aug any more movementacc would make it useless. The Aug is renowned for its accuracy and DOT. Taking away its accuracy makes the Aug useless, as its DOT would actually be severely weakened.

No matter how much self-bink, it doesn't really affect the Aug anyway if you can control the fire well. Increasing the self-bink only lowers the amount of shots you can fire in a single burst with good accuracy. At the same time, too much self-bink is a pointless and stupid idea.

Now to consider the other advantages that the Aug has - Bullet push and Ammo. The bullet push allows the Aug to keep getting the upper hand at a distance. The ammo, though runs out relatively quickly, is reloaded very quickly too. Those two advantages are the two things that can be compromised to balance the Aug. Either it loses its advantage in bullet push, or it has less ammo advantage by forcing the user to reload his gun a lot more often or to make reloading troublesome.


There are other ways to balance the Aug, such as to power up the other weapons. Unfortunately, some weapons are very balance-sensitive - Ruger just to name a few. So the only option left is to tweak the Aug itself temporarily, until there is a way to buff up all the weapons nicely.



Back to the topic on MP5 vs Aug, both guns have their own advantages, but the problem lies in the fact that the Aug is more reliable in many situations, and the MP5 is losing out to the Aug as a result. It is true that many guns are map-specific, and MP5 is one such weapon other than the Spas. Then again, its performance doesn't really outshine the Aug, which can provide an almost near equal + more versatility and reliability.

[Lumen-Shroom]

Aug is way better imo. It's a dedicated push long range accuracy weapon that won't let you spray. MP5 is a confused minigun-shotgun with a small clip and horrendous bullet speed.