gun worse than any other gun.

[BondJamesBond]

There is no real way to test out a gun. People use it for different purposes, and that's pretty big variable in itself. And I don't need to play a 1v1 against you to prove anything, mainly because I am a saw user. I do not represent the auto users in nearly any way.

In response to TiReD

1. Just because you can doesn't mean you should.
2. Vice-versa for 1v1s and why they are not accurate measurements.
3. Ah! Perfect, you finally get it. Just because the Mp5 is an auto, doesn't mean it has to be advantageous over any other auto - Which is following the same idea as just because it is an auto "doesnt mean its a "ZOMG U BINKED ME""
4. You do realize that the ruger and deagles are just as widely used as autos, and that those guns are just as potent as any auto?

you rarely get a chance to take out 2 ppl at the same time with nades especially in ctf gathers ect

Tip, use choke points. And this is also more proof that people use the same weapon differently.

[excruciator]

^^^^

then what is the right way to "measure" a weapons power??

1 on 1 doesnt work, all users have different experience about the weapon, what works?

I dont think mp5 is underpowered, aim is the key. if you have a great aim, you can probably kill 2 people while suffering minimum dmg because mp5 is so fast and so damaging. Eventhough im not a mp5 user, but whenever i used it, mp5 never failed me. Again, if you suck at aiming, mp5 wont excel in anything because the dmg nerf made aim factor more important than ever(for mp5).

People should stop complaining about how weapon is ineffective, instead, they should practice, and perfect the weapon.When the crop does not grow well, do you blame the crop, or is the farmer not taking enough care of his crops? (absurd analogy :p)

[TiReD]

1. Just because you can doesn't mean you should.
2. Vice-versa for 1v1s and why they are not accurate measurements.
3. Ah! Perfect, you finally get it. Just because the Mp5 is an auto, doesn't mean it has to be advantageous over any other auto - Which is following the same idea as just because it is an auto "doesnt mean its a "ZOMG U BINKED ME""
4. You do realize that the ruger and deagles are just as widely used as autos, and that those guns are just as potent as any auto?

1. None of the weapons i listed can be used(or are suited for) 1v1
2. Not a perfect, but the "best" way to do it(imo obviously).
3. Right, just because it isnt a auto doesnt mean it should bink like the steyr, but does it have as many pros as the other autos?.
4. Deagles and ruger as potent as autos?... ARE YOU KIDDING ME?, HAVE YOU EVER PLAYED WITH A GOOD RUGER/DEAGLES USER ON YOUR SIDE?. Both can kill 2 guys WITHOUT reloading.

Also, deagles have a fire interval of 0.5(with a reload of 1.5 seconds) and ruger has around 0.65(reload of around 1.6 seconds).

[BondJamesBond]

Since your responses to 1 and 2 are opinions that mean nothing without support - I have to ignore them.

And you obviously missed the point of number three.

4. So now we're talking about team games, are we? Well in the case of a team match, two or more autos will easily pin down an deagles or ruger.

[excruciator]

ohh yeah, thats really balanced, 2 auto can pin down a deagle. but a single auto cant...

[TiReD]

Since your responses to 1 and 2 are opinions that mean nothing without support - I have to ignore them.

And you obviously missed the point of number three.

4. So now we're talking about team games, are we? Well in the case of a team match, two or more autos will easily pin down an deagles or ruger.

Most of your posts are just opinions, without any backup or anything, which leads me to think you really didnt read the weapons.ini.

Oh well, im not gonna go on the stupid game of "YOUR OPINIAN SUCKS", the point is: mp5 needs a buff, it should be a damage one, and maybe reducing some bink.

[BondJamesBond]

Right, because you don't know how to utilize the mp5's true abilities, you suggest the change to make it easier for you. But you know. It's your "OPINIAN" now isn't it?

[ElGato]

omg I love this thread.

Ok then, ill hold an auto tournament, anyone who can beat me with mp5 whilst i use my favorite ak or minimi..will get a special prize.  xfire is ryan390. this is one way to sort a difference of opinion.

Weird tournament idea..... When is it? :p

If the Mp5 stands NO CHANCE AT ALL against ANY OTHER auto in a 1v1 battle, then im sorrry, but it needs a boost. that test is fair enough to realise it's not as great as people think.

I agree, M79 needs a big boost to make it better.

1. All weapons are able to go on 1v1 except minigun, mp5 and m79(barrett is one of the best if you have a nice accuracy.)

The bolded section is exactly why it's a bad test, barret IS the best if played correctly where as in a team game it's not the most effective by any means. 1v1=/= all of soldat.

2. Team matches are not a accurate measurement of skill, why? cause youve got other people weakening the enemy, and youre not focused on killing the other dudes.

Yet it is still clear who and what weapons are effective. And if the concern is the balance in team games.... then yes it is. That's the problem, this thread isn't specific to 1v1, DM, or any other game mode.

3. Im sorry, what?. It being a auto doesnt mean its a "ZOMG U BINKED ME" weapon, its hard as hell to bink a lot with ak, and with mp5 its hard to even get to a barrett user to bink him. The "ultimate" binking weapon is steyr.

Or minimi... but that's beside the point. Somone who is good with the Mp5 can bink a barret pretty easily unless the person is camping, in which case no auto could bink but point taken I s'pose.... It doesn't do it as well.

4. Why does it need to be able to compete with the other weapons that are like it?...

I think what he means is not all guns need to be the same, up close the Mp5 holds it's own and that doesn't have to be proven. Furthermore in many team games you can't always simply stay back and always keep distance so its range isn't as big a factor as some people say, same reason many are still effective with the deagles and m79.

ohh yeah, thats really balanced, 2 auto can pin down a deagle. but a single auto cant...

A single Barret can't take an auto. I have posted this rock, paper, scissors shit soooo many times. The deciding factor there is skill in almost all situations.

the point is: mp5 needs a buff, it should be a damage one, and maybe reducing some bink.

Increasing damage slightly won't address the issues you posted about it at all. Increase it more than slightly and it would be a monster in the correct hands.

[TiReD]

Right, because you don't know how to utilize the mp5's true abilities, you suggest the change to make it easier for you. But you know. It's your "OPINIAN" now isn't it?

Sure, i dont. (Funny coming from someone i havent even played with.)

Increasing damage slightly won't address the issues you posted about it at all. Increase it more than slightly and it would be a monster in the correct hands.

The problem with mp5 is that youre not doing decent damage while trying to get close to others, while theyre doing normal to good damage on you. Make the bullets lose less power on the distance?, i dunno.

[ElGato]

Honestly though I find I do perfectly well with the Mp5, especially on smaller maps where it is a more than adequate gun.

[Clawbug]

1v1: M79/barrett. Other guns are useless.
Small maps: M79/Barrett/Mp5/Spas, other guns are useless.

[Ziem]

1v1: M79/barrett. Other guns are useless.
Small maps: M79/Barrett/Mp5/Spas, other guns are useless.

Small maps: + Ruger?

[excruciator]

1v1: M79/barrett. Other guns are useless.
Small maps: M79/Barrett/Mp5/Spas, other guns are useless.

Small maps: + Ruger?

correction:
small maps: ruger
big maps: ruger
ctf maps: ruger
easy to camp maps: ruger
inf maps: ruger
dm maps: ruger

[ElGato]

1v1: M79/barrett. Other guns are useless.
Small maps: M79/Barrett/Mp5/Spas, other guns are useless.

Small maps: + Ruger?

correction:
small maps: any gun but minigun
big maps: any gun but minigun
ctf maps: any gun but minigun
easy to camp maps: any gun but minigun
inf maps: any gun but minigun
dm maps: any gun but minigun

Edited for most reasonably skilled players.

[excruciator]

1v1: M79/barrett. Other guns are useless.
Small maps: M79/Barrett/Mp5/Spas, other guns are useless.

Small maps: + Ruger?

correction:
small maps: any gun but minigun
big maps: any gun but minigun
ctf maps: any gun but minigun
easy to camp maps: any gun but minigun
inf maps: any gun but minigun
dm maps: any gun but minigun

Edited for most reasonably skilled players.

hah you are right elgato, skilled players would own with anything, but lesser skilled player, can only own with the ruger, so yeah, *whisper* most overpowred......

[Ziem]

1v1: M79/barrett. Other guns are useless.
Small maps: M79/Barrett/Mp5/Spas, other guns are useless.

Small maps: + Ruger?

correction:
small maps: any gun but minigun
big maps: any gun but minigun
ctf maps: any gun but minigun
easy to camp maps: any gun but minigun
inf maps: any gun but minigun
dm maps: any gun but minigun

Edited for most reasonably skilled players.

hah you are right elgato, skilled players would own with anything, but lesser skilled player, can only own with the ruger, so yeah, *whisper* most overpowred......

Sure it's overpowered, but it's quite funny to have 18\0 kd ratio on nuubia xD (law as secondary).

But in 3v3 cw I'd rather use ak or steyr. Ruger/spas on alt route, but I don't like altrouting ;p

[ElGato]

The point I was trying to make is that any gun is suitable anywhere if you know how to use it. Now, with that being said, I agree the ruger is a bit more powerful than it should be but not by much. And I can't see a good way to alter it as it is.

Slower rate of fire? Might balance it on the "pro" end of the spectrum but it screws newer players even more and would be rarely seen in pubs. As it is I see autos and 1-shots dominating.

[Ziem]

The point I was trying to make is that any gun is suitable anywhere if you know how to use it. Now, with that being said, I agree the ruger is a bit more powerful than it should be but not by much. And I can't see a good way to alter it as it is.

Slower rate of fire? Might balance it on the "pro" end of the spectrum but it screws newer players even more and would be rarely seen in pubs. As it is I see autos and 1-shots dominating.

Could sound a bit funny, but ruger is somewhat noob (pwning everyone on pubs after playing soldat for month... -.-).
Ruger - you need 50% aim to kill with it. Is it *that* much? If you CAN'T, then do barretard's tactic (shoot till the clip ends, use nades, secondary (socom/knife, as you can't run away while shooting law), and ruuuuun away).

[Mitak]

MP5 is annoying, therefore it's fine. Well, after playing with it I must say
it empties an entire clip pretty fast, leaving only 1 or 2 dead bodies behind.
It's fine with me.

[Sir Jeremy]

MP5 when you shoot it the bullets aren't very accuret.  it should get like 40 bullets though