My first try at mapping...

[Magus86]

So here are two maps I made. I'm not going to submit them for DOWNload just yet, but I've attached two pictures to show you guys what they look like... I'll probably make a few more and release them together as a pack. What do you guys think?

[Hair|Trigger]

Not too bad, multi-mode maps, right? (DM, RM, PM etc..)

[iDante]

Several important things to work on (in order of importance):
Layout, all of them are far too complex, too many platforms, etc. When starting out just go with a simple layout. Draw it out on paper, then sketch it out in polyworks, then do the actual poly work. Or download RR's laygen (search forums for 'laygen') and spend like... 10 hours clicking refresh until something nice pops up (thats what I do anyways).
Acute angles. Noone likes them, except in climbing maps.
Scenery, actually not bad, but be sure to put them on different layers and put the back layer's opacity down. Works like a charm.

[Magus86]

Not too bad, multi-mode maps, right? (DM, RM, PM etc..)

But of course... both multi-mode. No waypoints(not even sure what they're for. I'm guessing bots, but I don't care about bots. if someone wants to play 'em with bots, they can give them waypoints too).

Several important things to work on (in order of importance):
Layout, all of them are far too complex, too many platforms, etc. When starting out just go with a simple layout. Draw it out on paper, then sketch it out in polyworks, then do the actual poly work. Or download RR's laygen (search forums for 'laygen') and spend like... 10 hours clicking refresh until something nice pops up (thats what I do anyways).
Acute angles. Noone likes them, except in climbing maps.
Scenery, actually not bad, but be sure to put them on different layers and put the back layer's opacity down. Works like a charm.

Too complex?? The idea was to give LOTS of different points of contact with enemies/lots of different paths to take, rather than make it like counterstrike in which every encounter occurs at the same 2 or 3 places for every map. A lot of soldat maps are like this too, I've noticed,  and I don't like it.

As far as sketching is concerned, I'm definitely not going to do that. That to me is like "brainstorming" before writing something in school. I don't see the point. I never really had any ideas, I was just screwing with polyworks and making it up as I went, really.

What's wrong with acute angles, and why does it matter if it's for climbing or not?

With the scenery, I put it all in front(actually, a tiny bit is in the middle and the back, but no transparency) cuz I was going for that dense vegetation look for places to hide. It started out as just the middle green islands. Then I decided to add some rocks and make it larger. At that point, I decided to make a ctf version, and then I added the vegetation. The idea behind that was you can take many different paths, and even if you're followed, as long as you get where you're going quickly enough, the vegetation is thick & tall enough to provide you with a hiding spot, even with the flag. It adds a bit more strategy, as you're not just running like hell the entire time. You can do that, but it might not do you much good.  As you can see, the 2nd one(one on the bottom) isn't as bad with this.

I literally just picked up polyworks 2 days ago.

Oh, and by the way... since the screen I took of the first map is the non-colored team base version(deathmatch version... with the 2nd map, i just left it colored with both versions), I'd like to point out that the team bases are located on the two outer mid-height rocks.

I want to take a stab at recreating a map from Rogue Spear, possibly even a full pack to go along with the mod I made... trouble with that, though, is that soldat is not 3D, and it's gonna be hard deciding exactly which angle to do it from, and which map. Hmm... I could probably do a decent Killhouse 2-Story and Killhouse Double... The possibilities... I'm sure I'll be screwing with polyworks some more over the weekend. We'll se what happens, and I'll be posting screenshots.

[iDante]

Too complex?? The idea was to give LOTS of different points of contact with enemies/lots of different paths to take, rather than make it like counterstrike in which every encounter occurs at the same 2 or 3 places for every map. A lot of soldat maps are like this too, I've noticed,  and I don't like it.

Its good that you want lots of room, but the first map has far too many platforms. Non-negotiable.

As far as sketching is concerned, I'm definitely not going to do that. That to me is like "brainstorming" before writing something in school. I don't see the point. I never really had any ideas, I was just screwing with polyworks and making it up as I went, really.

That is definitely up to you, however... if you don't at least have some sort of plan you get random and often-not-fun maps.

What's wrong with acute angles, and why does it matter if it's for climbing or not?

They are ugly, and easy to get caught on. In climbing maps they make good spikes.

As for scenery... put grass on the middle level, don't have so many of the same types of trees n stuff right next to each other, and other stuff that I'm too tired to mention...

[Magus86]

Why is that far too many...? Because most people don't do that many platforms? So what, I'm not here to fit in and conform to the community. I'm here to show off what I've made. Who ever said there was a limit on platforms anyway, and what's the limit?

As far as the angles are concerned, I tested the map and fixed whatever problems I could find, and I had no trouble with the angles.

[Blacksheepboy]

You post maps for them to be reviewed by the community. We are like a committee. If there is something wrong with your map, we as mappers want to let you know where these faults exist. I'm sure you are aware of the procedure...

I personally think map #2 is fine for the most part. Map #1 is just too random. Stray away from designs like that. A compilation of platforms making a self-sufficient area, then random open space surrounding that, plus more platforms above: not a very great design. I have no mind to go into specifics as to why that design is not very good... maybe another time.

Edit:

For starters, Map #1 is rough, to the point that playing on it would be an irritation rather than a joy. Look at Wraithlike's mapping tutorial for references to smooth gameplay. Some of it can be applied to DM maps. I am not in the mood to reiterate the technicalities of smooth gameplay. A few rough spots are never bad, but the whole map is full of slow movement.

As you will see, or have seen: Wraithlike addresses smooth terrain within the first few lines of the tutorial:

http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=29244.msg348501#msg348501

For a DM map, you obviously don't have to be as picky about smoothness as in a CTF map, but it should still be a high priority.

Edit2:

 

[MyiEye]

YES!!!!!!
and about the sharp points. Most mappers simply say NO!, of course n00bs will have the most frustrating time of their life repeatedly getting stuck on them, but they have a lot of potential and if you're used to them they're not much of a problem.

You've got some pretty good looking shading on the first map and you probably decided that the 2nd one would be fine without, but I disagree. Firstly the lower long green platform coll use some brown shading underneath it. Secondly, I'm not too sure about this one, but you might want to shade the top of the dark brown section to a slightly lighter shade. Third, you could merge the blue and red platforms with the color of the wall. I also think that the map would be better with a darker background....maybe dark brown, blue or even green. Light backgrounds are almost always a little annoying to play on, cause it can make it hard to see your crosshair as well as bullets. You could also use scenery to make the background of the lower tunnel actually like a tunnel ie. look through your texture folder and fine one that looks like dirt and then copy it too your scenery folder and fill the tunnel with it. I'm gonna sound stupid saying this, but the top route is too plain and I don't know what to do about that.
Hope this help

[Magus86]

New map, better screenshots...

[Snack]

Those are far too many kits oO

[Magus86]

Why? It's not like they're all on the map at once... it just means that where they will spawn is more random because there are possible spawns all over the map. I'd rather have random than having everything spawn at the exact same place every time.

[Snack]

Yeah, you're right :]

[The Geologist]

What's the frequency for nade/health drops?  If it's set too high, so many spawns could be a really annoyance during game play. 

Also, the most recent map/picture needs some shading and balance work.  CTF with a height advantage for one team doesn't usually work out too well.  Not to mention large, open spaces tend to slow game play. 

[Magus86]

Yes I know, and I don't plan to have a shitload of kits on the map at once. If I remember correctly, all 3 are set for 5 of each.

As far as the height is concerned, It's still equal. Think about it. The Blue team needs to jet up to get the flag, so it might be more difficult for them to steal it. However, it's an easier trip back to their base to capture. Whereas the red team has an easier time stealing the flag, but they have to go back up to return it to their base and make the capture. The way I see it, it should even out. I haven't done any extensive testing yet, but that's the idea.

[Blacksheepboy]

(referring to mostly white map)

But, red has the height advantage. Since bullets have simple gravity, it is much easier to rain bullets down upon someone's head, rather that to shoot upwards at someone's feet.

Therefore, Alpha could make a quick raid, kill most of blue, snatch the flag and they are basically home-free. Whereas Bravo team has to climb up to Alpha's perch, fighting against biased opposition. Understandibly, Bravo could make an easy cap once the flag is gotten. That feature alone doesn't make it even though.

Placing kits in more strategic and planned areas can often change gameplay for the better, but randomness is not always bad, just something I don't prefer. Personally, I like to return to the same place often times to find a grenade kit waiting for me. It provides a small objective to achieve.

[The Geologist]

Also, massive nade spam.

[Magus86]

randomness can also reduce camping, because you never know where the kits will be. I've seen people camp the kits before.


It's not like alpha can just sit up top and chuck grenades and shoot down into oblivion... there's a nice sized island hovering over the blue base to prevent that.

[Blacksheepboy]

Eh, I meant in moderation... whatever. You've maintained a good point.

[Magus86]

Some small modifications.

[MyiEye]

One problem with a big height difference is...gravity not only affecting the players but the bullets too. Just imagine a blue guy tries to use an m79!! he's have a heck of a lot of trouble shooting the guy with an m79 above him. It's the same with other weapons like spas, mp5, deagles grenades. They could obviously choose not to use these weapons, but it is still a disadvantage.

Random spawn points is not altogether bad, but it does take away from strategy a bit.

Just a tip, change up the color of your scenery....the bunkers for example. Maps look more professional if they aren't too default in color.

I really like the adjustments you've made to FugYa