Barrett as a secondary weapon

[The Epic Guy]

I know this would never happen. I just want to know what you think. So it's less of a suggestion and more of a realistic opinion. But Barrett as a secondary? You're probably thinking "Hell no!", and I understand that, but lets look at the facts.

1. Its a sniper rifle.

Of all the primary weapons, none make less sense as the Barrett. What would you take with you into the heat of battle? The AK, DEs, MP5, hell, even the minigun, but the Barrett? The Barrett is a sniper's weapon, and a sniper isn't usually found on the frontline, he's found in a clock tower half a mile away. All the other primaries are meant to be in close or medium range fights. All of you would agree to this, and this is probably the way it was originally supposed to be, due to its huge moveacc and bink, but alot of us have found a way to override this. Now all of the other primaries just cant compete in one-on-one fights. I seriously have seen only a couple players use the Barrett effectively the way a sniper rifle is meant to be used.

An easy way to change this would be to move it to the secondaries, and make it so it can only be fired on the ground. But there's a couple problems in the way.

1. It would just be another LAW.
2. Its would probably be an overpowered secondary.
3. Huge weapon balance issues. The entire weapon balance would have to be rethinked and redone.
4. Chances are that there would be a flaw in the new Barrett that would allow players to use it effectively in close quarters.
5. The Barrett has been a primary for years, and people have grown used to it. This is why most would disagree (besides personally being non-sniper Barrett users).

The fact is that its too late. There are too many complications in doing this now. If the Barrett was originally a secondary, then people would probably disagree with making it a primary. But if the Barrett was originally a secondary, people would actually be sniping. And if the Barrett was originally a secondary, then the Barrett would be a whole different weapon. So I can't really ask for your support, but just for your opinion. Put snipers in their place.

Oh, and while you're at it, exchange the Barrett with another sniper rifle, preferably a bolt action sniper. In real life, The Barrett is a semi-automatic beast that can fire a round every second. In Soldat, I could take a piss and eat a sandwich before it's loaded another round.

[inurro]

Now all of the other primaries just cant compete in one-on-one fights.

A good sprayer/dodger can EASILY beat a barret in a 1v1

[The Epic Guy]

I know, but thats not what this is about, and ive seen the opposite happen as well.

[mxyzptlk]

Do you know of any bolt action 50 Cal rifles?

[The Epic Guy]

Do you know of any bolt action 50 Cal rifles?

Nope. Is that the only reason that it was chosen? I would have chosen a sniper rifle that would translate better into Soldat.

[Ziem]

No?
Barret is a primary since first versions of Soldat. Should it be changed? Why?

If you wanna exchange it with other sniper rifle --> mod it.

[~Niko~]

Are you kidding me? Barret as secondary? Are you mad? I'm Barrett user, and I have enough with a knife and a Barrett... Do that would turn the game in anything else...

In a 1vs1 fight, you are spraying in the enemy face, you two binked, and you think that you would be able to make a Barrett shot aimed right to the enemy's head in mid-air and binked? Stop that dream, dude.

[The Epic Guy]

What im trying to say is that most of the Barrett users aren't even snipers. And it makes no sense. Isn't the Barrett suppossed to be a sniper weapon? And the few that use the Barrett right get bashed for being "campers" even if they're using it the right way.

[PaFel]

Do you know of any bolt action 50 Cal rifles?

McMillan TAC .50, CheyTac M200 (basicly .408 but produced as .50 version too), Barrett M95, Barret M99 (one shoot) .

Barrett M82 weight - 12,9 kg.

10 12,7 rounds - ~1,16 kg (without magazine).

How you'd carry it? . It's also such a big weapon that it would make you unable to move .

[The Epic Guy]

How you'd carry it? . It's also such a big weapon that it would make you unable to move .

I dunno, we've been carrying miniguns around for a while, so...

[PaFel]

I dunno, we've been carrying miniguns around for a while, so...

Yea but minigun is at least primary weapon .

[Laser Guy]

If Barret was enabled as Secondary most  people would have it as secondary :/
1) Long range Knife vs Barret - Barret wins most of the time
2) Quicker reload/being ready to shoot LAW vs Barret - LAW shots once and in that time Barret shots about 3 times >.>

F11

[STM1993]

Hmm... Barrett as a secondary? I'm very strongly against it...

The Primary weapons are meant to be the guns that are usually carried around and used to engage in combat and therefore they are, overall, more powerful than the secondary weapons. Secondary weapons, on the other hand, are actually weapons meant to used as backup weapons and finishers, so they are not very powerful.

Look at the Barrett:
1) 1-hit-kill, unless with vest
2) Supreme range (Highest bullet speed and Scope)
3) Shoots at a 4 second interval + 25 ticks startup time before firing
4) Has 10 ammo, 5 second reload + 4 second interval total 9 second reload.
5) Has 100 bink and movementacc 7 (which can be easily countered)

When you're a sniper, you're a sniper. You're not really one who is built to rush. You either camp or you stay a distance and shoot (like the Ruger). This weapon makes you change to a play style which is good enough to be used throughout the match as your main weapon for killing. And its stats also ensures that it is strong enough to be a primary.




Now compare with the Secondary:

Socom
The only secondary that doesn't kill in 1-hit. Has 12 ammo, kills in 6 bullets. It's pretty weak ; not enough potential to match up to any Primary (unless the Primary user is REALLY weak), but strong enough to save its user and good enough as a finisher.

Knife
This short range secondary is meant to be thrown (the stabbing is next to useless). You hit, hope he dies (because if the knife speed is too low, it won't kill in 1-hit). You miss, you die. You can't find your knife, too bad. You meet a group of enemies, good luck. No one uses a knife as a primary in a real battle (clan wars and gathers), more like a weapon to quickly end fight that you are already being engaged in against a possible single enemy with high health when you're desperate.

Chainsaw
This is the true melee weapon. Usually 1-hit kill, pretty long-lasting, one of the best weapons in Soldat to mow through a whole row of enemies at once. The chainsaw is useless unless you can get close. The fact that its a melee weapon immediately makes it a secondary weapon already, since melee combat is pretty hard to achieve in Soldat.

LAW
This is the long-ranged secondary. It's similar enough to the Barrett, but tuned down a lot, so that it's not enough to be a Primary. You can't possibly use it like a Primary because it reloads with every shot which is so slow (About 8 seconds + 21 startup) and though it has the ability to shoot at long range and act as an artillery, it isn't strong enough to match the Barrett's range potential. Do you see people use it in the middle of heated fights often? Probably not, they'd use the knife if that were the case. The LAW is more of a weapon to end potential fights before it even begins and has explosive power to push back enemies or boost teammates. Because of all its disadvantages of only being able to be fired when on the ground, lack of a scope and its terribly slow reload, it can only be a secondary. Chances are, you would only fire the LAW once in every time you spawn, it's rare that you have a chance to even reload.


Notice that the secondary weapons are all finishers and backup weapons, one way or another. Secondary weapons are generally weapons that are meant to back up and act as finishers, or possibly to support the Primary weapon in its weaknesses. If you are using a Barrett and with any secondary, you'll still be a sniper throughout. No way you can have a Barrett + Socom and become a rusher with long range capabilities. No, if you want to be a rusher, you'd probably use a more effective combo like an auto + the LAW.




So, no, F11. Making the Barrett a secondary still allows the Barrett to be used like a Primary. And no matter how you balance a Barrett into a secondary, it just wouldn't even be a proper gun. You nerf it too much, it's not even a sniper rifle. You nerf it too little, it's still a primary. And we've already got a secondary that can perform the same task well enough.


You can argue about the minigun, but actually, the minigun is strong enough to be a primary by itself. It's got the bullet push, it's got the potentially high damage per second (if all shots hit), and it changes your play style to be supposed to be that of a team supporter, and for a support weapon it is pretty powerful (though it could use a buff). Really, the minigun can beat a Socomer if the minigunner knows how to use it.

[The Epic Guy]

Obviously if the Barrett was moved to the secondaries, arrangements would have to be made.

But some of these point do make sense. I guess that sniper rushers are only commonly found in DM, because the chances of being ganged are much lower then CTF.

[UnknownSniper]

Simple cure; Choose barrett + a secondary, change weapons.
TA-DA! Barrett is a secondary. Congratulations.

[The Epic Guy]

Simple cure; Choose barrett + a secondary, change weapons.
TA-DA! Barrett is a secondary. Congratulations.

LOL

[Pragma]

Simple cure; Choose barrett + a secondary, change weapons.
TA-DA! Barrett is a secondary. Congratulations.

WIN

You can always *drop* your secondary weapon and pick up another weapon of your choice, usually from on top of a pile of hamburger that was your teammate. Yea, the selection isn't always that great, but it's do-able.  You can even go dual-barrett and fast-swap to take 'em by surprise.

[tehsnipah]

I don't think you would want a barret as a secondary weapon. Who would want a wapon that needs 3 seconds of load first?

[Hair|Trigger]

I use baz on the "front line"

in soldat, a "Sniper Rifle" doesn't have to be used from half a mile away, nor do you need to camp with it. 

Besides, this doesn't qualify as an 'improvement' to the game, more of a change/possibility that will never happen

Date Posted: August 29, 2008, 08:58:48 am

Simple cure; Choose barrett + a secondary, change weapons.
TA-DA! Barrett is a secondary. Congratulations.

Idiots :/ 

[The Epic Guy]

All really good points. Makes alot of sense.

Still hate the guys that bring the Barrett right in your face. But thats just me.

Oh well, no real use for this thread now.