1.5.0 Steyr Aug discussion

[STM1993]

[4 - Steyr AUG] (1.5.0)
Damage=74
FireInterval=7
Ammo=25
ReloadTime=115
Speed=260
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=-19
MovementAcc=2
Recoil=0

Previous versions:
1.4.0 - 1.4.2: Damage 73, Ammo 30, Bink -22
1.3.1: Damage 73, Ammo 30, Bink -33, Movementacc 1

The Aug's combat ability has slightly improved, sporting minorly improved damage and reduced bink. However, this is at the cost of losing 5 ammo. Since 1.5.0, the bullet push of all guns including the Steyr Aug has been reduced to 75%.

The Aug:
A fast-firing, versatile auto. It has a relatively low DPS, but it has a high DOT as a result of its high firing rate. The Aug also possesses a high bullet speed, meaning it flies relatively straight, and this gives the Aug a long range. This ultimately gives the Aug some bullet push power over the other guns and a higher tolerance for missing without losing too much DOT.

The Aug's firing rate has a unique feature. The first shot from an automatic burst of fire from the Aug goes like normal, while subsequent automatic shots are fired at a slightly upward angle. This strangely increases the Aug's accuracy, so when firing the Aug, the first shot is usually considered inaccurate and redundant. To prevent the Aug from being too accurate, movementacc 2 was introduced, though the Aug would still remain to be extremely accurate.

In order to control the DOT of the Aug, self-bink is introduced to the Aug. This forces users to fire in controlled bursts rather than full-automatic all the way. It drains ammo quickly, but it has a fast reload to allow the gunner to be able to continue his assault without having to wait too long.

Effects of the changes:
The very minor increase in damage allows the Aug to be slightly more effective at long range since it can do slightly more damage and it can kill wounded enemies more quickly, though this change is quite insignificant.

The decreased self-bink would mean that the Aug can be fired in a longer burst without losing too much accuracy. This can significantly improve the Aug's accuracy for prolonged fire and increased DOT.

The bullet push of all guns have been reduced to 75%. This makes the Aug less able to manipulate the opponents' movements and makes the game more offensive than defensive.

The ammo is reduced by 5, so that the Aug-user may be less able in killing more than 1 opponent by limiting its total damage output in a single clip. It also forces the Aug-user to watch his ammo more carefully. Initially, many players were psychologically shaken by the reduction of ammo. However, players have learned to adapt to this.



Despite these changes, is still the best weapon for CTF, owing to the auto's versatility as well as its ease of use. It is also still the most popular, though it has already lost some popularity and the next weapon is catching up quickly (AK).

The fact that the Aug's combat ability is raised to compensate its lowered ammo is reduced sparks a potential debate as to whether the Aug has really been buffed or nerfed, and whether the Aug is balanced the way it should be, or not.

Note that other weapons have been changed as well, and some are gaining more recognition, such as the MP5.



Discuss the new Steyr Aug in Soldat 1.5.0. The major issues:
1) Accuracy
2) Ammo/Reload
3) Other weapons?

The slightly increased damage is not so important, but still noteworthy.

[-Major-]

The Aug is nerfed, before it was more accurate and one could really rape every thing with it. now the better weapons are AK and Minimi. due to the Semis buffs and autos nerfs Semis are now seen more often.

I liked it with more selfbink as it was more accurate than it is now, as you can remove the movement acc quicker with more selfbink.

[Ragnaros]

In my view AUG in 1.5 is nerfed too much...

now it needs more damage: 76-78

btw i think that 25 ammo is a good decision, as -Major- said, with 30 ammo you could easily make double kill with one clip vs two opponents AT THE SAME TIME AND VERY FAST: both with 100% hp

in 1.5 i choose aug ONLY at long, open spaces when i need rush enemy's base + hurt(rare - kill) its defenders, or to shoot back while flag-carrying

i remember how in 1.4.2 i was clearing whole rooms with one maximum two clips...

but now! i cant even beat two guys with AK!
i see an original way to rebalance Steyr: give it MORE DAMAGE! anybody think so?

[Clawbug]

No more damage. The only thing people care is that how fast they can kill enemies, giving AUG more damage will boost it quite damn much.

[Ragnaros]

oh one more thing:

...Despite these changes, is still the best weapon for CTF,...

CANT AGREE. Aug as the best weapon for CTF. I have never seen a guy PWNing everybody at CTF with Steyr Aug in 1.5... much more often - ak, mp5 (or spas/ruger if the map is suitable for close/long range)

[Clawbug]

oh one more thing:

...Despite these changes, is still the best weapon for CTF,...

CANT AGREE. Aug as the best weapon for CTF. I have never seen a guy PWNing everybody at CTF with Steyr Aug in 1.5... much more often - ak, mp5 (or spas/ruger if the map is suitable for close/long range)

Haven't played with the right people.

[Rook_PL]

I always liked the changes form one version to another, new discussions and so, but with the AUG now I can't play with other secondary than socom for finishes. Without 12 socom clip aug's useless for me. The time has come to learn how to aim properly. Damn.

[[SIRS]Foxconn^^2012]

I Have New Settings For Steyr

Damage=78
FireInterval=8
Ammo=32
ReloadTime=115
Speed=295
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=-16
MovementAcc=2
Recoil=0

[-Major-]

I Have New Settings For Steyr

Damage=78
FireInterval=8
Ammo=32
ReloadTime=115
Speed=295
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=-16
MovementAcc=2
Recoil=0

That would just be a new AK.

[STM1993]

it was more accurate and one could really rape every thing with it.

How was the Aug more accurate before?

The past Aug (as in 1.4.2) accuracy is essentially the same as the one now in 1.5, except that it had -22 bink instead of -19 bink, so in fact the new Aug should be more accurate, allowing it to have a longer burst of fire without losing too much accuracy. Lower self-bink = less inaccuracy, not the other way round.

i see an original way to rebalance Steyr: give it MORE DAMAGE! anybody think so?

That'd be giving the Aug too much firepower. If you couldn't really kill anyone, you need to work on your aiming. If you have poor aim, the new Aug is really terrible, but if you have mastered the Aug, it's still about as formidable as it was before, just with slightly lower ammo.

Damage=78
FireInterval=8
Ammo=32
ReloadTime=115
Speed=295
BulletStyle=1
StartUpTime=0
Bink=-16
MovementAcc=2
Recoil=0

Straight no.

1) There is no need to increase the bullet speed any further. That'd make the Aug have too long a range, plus it makes it able to hit enemies far easier.
2) Fireinterval 8 is a buggy fireinterval. For the damage, it still kills in 9 shots, but it deals too much damage per shot.
3) 32 ammo and with 115 reload, that's too much ammo and too fast a reload.
4) Last but not least, this is COMPLETELY changing the weapon. It's a pre-1.4.0 Minimi. Undesirable.

[8th_account]

He could be talking about the moveacc increase, though that happened in 1.4 or something ancient.

[STM1993]

He could be talking about the moveacc increase, though that happened in 1.4 or something ancient.

Ahh right, I missed that out.

So should the Aug have the accuracy it had before (more self-bink but no movementacc) or the way it is now? If it had more self-bink but no movementacc, it is extremely accurate but is limited in the sense that you have to fire in short bursts. If it is the way it is now, it is not as accurate (but still pretty accurate) but can be fired in a longer burst.

I'm okay with the way the Aug is now, but I feel that the gun can still be tweaked via the accuracy, which also affects the DOT.

[excruciator]

Aug is good. the -5 ammo rewards people who's got superb aim to make 2kill/clip instead of just 1.

[-Major-]

no, with more selfbink, you can override your movement acc faster, making it more accurate.
for those of you who didn't know, you're supposed to stop each burst within the time you're waiting for the next bullet, and voila, no bink, no movement acc.

[STM1993]

no, with more selfbink, you can override your movement acc faster, making it more accurate.
for those of you who didn't know, you're supposed to stop each burst within the time you're waiting for the next bullet, and voila, no bink, no movement acc.

I get what you mean now.

Self-bink only affects from the 4th bullet onwards, that's one thing to note. Another thing to note is that the first bullet of an Aug's burst is often considered "inaccurate" and is therefore ignored in most cases.

The accuracy issue goes both ways. If there is less self-bink (but NOT without self-bink), then the gun would be accurate for a longer period of continuous fire. As bink will gradually reset to 0, and if the bink value was not high enough, by the time the 4th shot of the next burst is fired, the bink has already reset and movementacc takes place instead of the bink. Ironically, to achieve such a value, one must fire for a prolonged period of time. By the time that value is reached, it might be possible that the target is already killed.

On the flip side, a gun with higher self-bink (but not too high) cannot be fired for a long period of time and must be fired in controlled burst. However, its self-bink is high enough such that it only requires a few shots to reach the high bink value in which the bink can't reset to 0 by the time the 4th shot of the next burst is fired, so that the bink still overrides the movementacc. Depending on the movementacc of the weapon and the pause time between 2 bursts, this may make the gun more accurate than the above case. The Aug has only movementacc 2 however, so I don't think it really works compared to the above.

The conflict lies in whether the Aug should be controlled by short accurate burst or a long stream of fire. The way it is now, it follows the latter and the logic that self-bink overrides movementacc, which also makes the Aug easier to use since users no longer need to face the problem of the "inaccurate first bullet" more than once per enemy. The former is what it was before, except that it had no movementacc at all, so using high bink to counter the movementacc was not necessary. Instead, the self-bink was used solely to control its DOT by controlling the optimum number of shots to be fired per burst.

I have not experimented with the accuracy similarity between a single movementacc value and a fixed bink value, but movementacc 2 has the inaccuracy of roughly between 22-32. I'm not sure how much bink decreases per tick too, but I guess it might be 1 bink per tick.



EDIT:
Crap, that reminds me: the Minimi has the same kind of issue too.

[-Major-]

here's a video on how the to use the Steyr, or atleast how I used it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDvqVpp-cH0&fmt=18

[STM1993]

here's a video on how the to use the Steyr, or atleast how I used it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDvqVpp-cH0&fmt=18

That's... something new. I never expected the Aug to be fired like that with that level of efficiency. O.O

I'll try it out and see it for myself (but it'd be hard for me because I have poor control).

EDIT:
Couldn't really get it, very hard, and even if I did, maybe I couldn't really see it and I wasn't very consistent, but it works, and you have the video evidence to show it. I tried it with a few other autos and a few mods and it worked in a similar fashion. Nice.



So you're suggesting that the bink be raised so that this can be done more easily. That'd work.

[-Major-]

when you miss the timing, 1 bullet will go lower than the others, because of the 7 fireinterval you already wrote about. with AK which got 8 fireinterval, the bullets doesn't bug if you miss the timing, but you'll hear when a bullet comes late.

[albertpaul68]

In my appearance AUG in 1.5 is nerfed too much...

now it needs added damage: 76-78

btw i anticipate that 25 ammo is a acceptable decision, as -Major- said, with 30 ammo you could calmly accomplish bifold annihilate with one blow vs two opponents AT THE SAME TIME AND VERY FAST: both with 100% hp

in 1.5 i accept aug ONLY at long, accessible spaces if i charge blitz enemy's abject + hurt(rare - kill) its defenders, or to shoot aback while flag-carrying

i bethink how in 1.4.2 i was allowance accomplished apartment with one best two clips..