Nuubia remake - multitextured

[DarkCrusade]

I am not quit sure about the name this map will have in the end, but it won´t matter till I finished the map. That´s why I post this map here to let you all see what I have created till now.



First of all: the old ctf_Nuubia:




Old Nuubia´s visuals are okay, but I tried to improve them. Also I changed the middle top part with that useless part that no one will ever use. Also you can see a new tunnel in the blue base (I am not sure about that one, if everyone thinks it is unnecessary I will remove it). Polycount went up but there won´t be that many bugs as there were in my old maps that had high polycounts, but till I´ve fixed all of them I won´t give the .PMS file to anyone


DarkCrusade version:




This map will get new waypoints also, all scenery will stay default, the texture is a .JPG.

[biohazard]

This small low tunnel balance a lil the bravo dominance, i think. Anyway, ppl use to say that multitexturing make FPS worst or something like this... btw, ima just in luv with the old Nuubia.
I like those off-screen art  in some maps anyway.

[Dusty]

one up for default

[~Niko~]

multitexturing is way too plain, spend some time strechin' it.

[zakath]

jpg texture will crash on nvidia cards just so you know.

[L[0ne]R]

So far so good. I'm no balance expert, so I can't comment much. To me original nuubia's balance was fine, and that tunnel gives me a bad feeling that it'll make things much easier for red.

Visuals:
Looks a bit empty. A few more trees/lianas/bushes/other "crap"?
A bit of texture stretching would be nice too.
Not really liking the "offmap" bits. They look a bit random and out of place.

[Cecilia]

Very Cool remake, that small tunnel on blue side looks like a great little addition. i like it

[As de Espada]

the outer lower part of the map is very nice, with some tweaks and stuff
that phantom island in the top of the map is unnecessary, and you really should make some variance on your borders (thinner and fatter xD, some scenerys comming from the ceil would be nice too)

[Boots]

original is better.

the tunnel is pointless tbh.

[DarkCrusade]

the outer lower part of the map is very nice, with some tweaks and stuff
that phantom island in the top of the map is unnecessary, and you really should make some variance on your borders (thinner and fatter xD, some scenerys comming from the ceil would be nice too)

It´s the first version of my remake where the playing ground is ready. I just added some "crap" to show you what it may look like in the final version. The final one will include texture stretching, more scenery and variance on the borders like you mentioned.

original is better.

the tunnel is pointless tbh.

Tunnel is balancing the game a bit. Old Nuubia was dominated by bravo and you should know that.

So far so good. I'm no balance expert, so I can't comment much. To me original nuubia's balance was fine, and that tunnel gives me a bad feeling that it'll make things much easier for red.

Visuals:
Looks a bit empty. A few more trees/lianas/bushes/other "crap"?
A bit of texture stretching would be nice too.
Not really liking the "offmap" bits. They look a bit random and out of place.

Maybe I will just screen the offmap polygons and save them as scenery or simply delete them, I am not sure which way I should take The texture stretching and more scenery will be added when I have the polygons ready like I mentioned above.

jpg texture will crash on nvidia cards just so you know.

Thanks for that. I will save the texture as .bmp and it will be okay, right?

This small low tunnel balance a lil the bravo dominance, i think. Anyway, ppl use to say that multitexturing make FPS worst or something like this... btw, ima just in luv with the old Nuubia.
I like those off-screen art  in some maps anyway.

About fps: I am not sure about that. When the map is ready we will see whether it makes fps worse or not.

[L[0ne]R]

Thanks for that. I will save the texture as .bmp and it will be okay, right?

If it's .bmp - it shouldn't cause any problems. Just make sure the file size isn't 100mb. ;O
Also, in case you didn't know: polygons have not just the texture, but also edge graphics located in Soldat/Textures/Edges/. But they only seem to work in v1.5.1.

[As de Espada]

loner, I've been told that smooth polygons is the option for edges in config

[L[0ne]R]

loner, I've been told that smooth polygons is the option for edges in config

Damn. I was pretty sure I had this on..
Thanks for letting me know. :S

[DarkCrusade]

Texture stretching, more "crap" and more colors are the visual changes. Polybug got fixed by invisible polygons (will work on edges, too). I need to work on the border and I will need to remove that offmap island to reduce polygoncount (reaching 800 right now).


If you have any suggestions, please post them here.

[Boots]

Tunnel is silly.


if your an experience player, you would know that this map is sometimes one sided, but a smarter team can win on either side.
this doesn't need game play changes, stop messing with the old maps, there perfect. i like the new visual looks, but the tunnel upsets me.

[DarkCrusade]

stop messing with the old maps

I won´t. I like to

if your an experience player, you would know that this map is sometimes one sided, but a smarter team can win on either side.

There are not only experienced players. Not only an elite of players. I didn´t say that I will leave the tunnel where it is. The tunnel is there for testing issues, if enough players think it is unnecessary I will remove it.

[zakath]

Tunnel is silly.


if your an experience player, you would know that this map is sometimes one sided, but a smarter team can win on either side.
this doesn't need game play changes, stop messing with the old maps, there perfect. i like the new visual looks, but the tunnel upsets me.

thats quite irrelevant saying a "better" team can win on either side. it has been shown on nuubia that if there are two "equal" teams bravo tend to win more. actually the balance in numbers are something like 65-35 in favour of bravo meaning that it isn't just a statistically irregularity but instead the map truly favours bravo.

[biohazard]

you can emulte earth/green without multitexture, just like viet (1.5-)

Btw, Bravo can spray well the higher route... so let Alpha...

[Boots]

more spray = more whine

[DarkCrusade]

I don´t see why I should let people spam at the top route. No, really, as Boots mentioned it will cause more whine.


@biohazard: I won´t change the texture. I don´t think that multitexturing causes FPS drops. A multitextured map consists out of the same polygons as an "usual" non multitextured map, the difference is, that a multitextured map has an increased amount of polygons and such an amount causes the FPS drops. Since the polygon count is below 775 right now I don´t see why it should make anyone´s FPS worse.


I get what you want to point out at the tunnel, but what does this fucked up picture mean that you placed at the Alpha base? (is that you?)

[biohazard]

nothin'

just tried to make a biohazard symbol... but... phailed hardy

[Suowarrior]

Default requirements say polycount less than 700. It's not that black and white, but we need to set line somewhere and mappers should obey them.

I can't see reason for bg scenery in tunnel.

I'm not sure how textures work, since I can see only pic, but it seems changing green to brown pretty fast, I don't like it.

Not 100% sure about bottom route, mostly it's helping alpha flagger to escape but that tunnel might be easy camp place for bravo flagger...

[DarkCrusade]

Default requirements say polycount less than 700. It's not that black and white, but we need to set line somewhere and mappers should obey them.

I can't see reason for bg scenery in tunnel.

I'm not sure how textures work, since I can see only pic, but it seems changing green to brown pretty fast, I don't like it.

Not 100% sure about bottom route, mostly it's helping alpha flagger to escape but that tunnel might be easy camp place for bravo flagger...

I will see what I can do to decrease the polycount.

I wanted to distinguish tunnel from jungle in the background. I don´t see any reason to remove the bg.

About texture: maybe it looks different for you in game, till now you only saw it from screen. Please wait for the first public version until judging that.

The tunnel is accessable for both teams, it helps Alpha members to enter Bravo´s base (referring to nade spamming) and leave it, but it´s not the way that it will give Bravo´s flag carrier an advantage that´s that big, no, I think the flag carrier should rather go up then down because of the height advantage. 100% aren´t needed anyway

[biohazard]

If the flag is here, like the original one, that tunnel is pretty useless.



Else, if its here, seem somewhat usefull... but, if you set it there, then youll make the EFCs life rly easy, cuz the fast'n'easy access to medikits

Ima just trying to help cuz i just luv the Nuubia, but i know its Bravo dominance... not rly sure if ima helping btw

[DarkCrusade]

At least you don´t confuse me, that´s a good start. I guess I will need to do completly new spawns for bravo then to keep it balanced ...  thanks, you are helping me

[DarkCrusade]

I´ve worked a lot more on this remake and experienced that little changes on the spawns of bravo manages the major problems with the new tunnel. You can see what I did on the big big screen below The entrances of the tunnel are bigger now, many sharp edges are fixed. I worked on the pitch black blank scenery and reduced the amount of scenery on this map by 48. I also removed a lot of polygons that were only set for better looks and this way I got to this map stats:

Polygons: 751 (before it were 891 polygons in use)
Scenery: 160 (no .PNG scenery, only .BMP)
Objects: 22

I guess I won´t come below 700 polygons so don´t waste your time suggesting to remove more. For now you get a big overview of the changes and the original map and a first download. I had not enough time to do the waypoints but I didn´t delete the old ones so you can play

[biohazard]

I liked as my first impression, but i think Bravo side is supposed to have 2 medikits spawn(one more at Bravo respawn. I liked how you force the map to havent edges. There are strange thing outmap btw...


Here you got a poly nade bug...

[DarkCrusade]

What did you try to tell me with that circle at the top right corner of the first picture? There are no medikits on that bravo spawn you can see on the first picture because I wanted to force the efc not to stay there since he can easily access the flag spawn from that position and to get more use of the tunnel since I moved the spawn downwards. I am not sure about your second suggestion but I will give it a try

[biohazard]

As i saved as gif, you can see well, but theres a strange line or something else there, but here you can see clearly:


About the second ss, i tried an old nade idle boost trick, but the nade just stuck inside the poly, like those on Ash.

[DarkCrusade]

If you tell me where you found that "nade-being-stuck-in-polygon" bug I am able to fix it. This strange line is already fixed, I just didn´t see that the blank is set in a wrong position.

[Suowarrior]

Ran over the map couple mins and it felt hard and buggy. Polyworks tells the truth:





No need for guessing which map got more polybugs. Not the nicest job to fix that at this point :S Just set the polygons doesn't collide and add one normal polygon behind. Use as few polys on playground as you can.

I'm sort of way fan of old nuubia look, it's unique and though it's cheap made, it looks good in game. In remake multitexturing is made with patience and it's good looking (though im not sure about sand matching nuubia theme). This is just small thing but imo it breaks a bit harmony there, fast change from sand to jungle. Also that black edge comes too quickly from edge.



As we all know Nuubia is one of the most popular maps, that's why it shouldn't have crucial gameplay changes, that new tunnel breaks originality of that map, and we can't know consequences of it, so big no for tunnel.

Also that new flag place is only making the play easier for bravo, alpha got even more longer way to steal the flag now. I prefer original placing.

About the rest gameplay changes:

[biohazard]

What did you try to tell me with that circle at the top right corner of the first picture? There are no medikits on that bravo spawn you can see on the first picture because I wanted to force the efc not to stay there since he can easily access the flag spawn from that position and to get more use of the tunnel since I moved the spawn downwards. I am not sure about your second suggestion but I will give it a try

The lost medikits is supposed to help the Alpha INC TOP after the fight, without them to recover HP, the incommer will die like a deer b4 even touch the flag.
p.s.: update the nade bug ss...

Also that new flag place is only making the play easier for bravo, alpha got even more longer way to steal the flag now. I prefer original placing.

I think the same, but its a longer way for Alpha to CAP too. Sincerely, its hard to know how well its balanced or not, without playing some matchs.
In my point of view, the most unbalanced thing about that map, is that ramp protecting Bravo side from spray (NOT SPRAY FEAST) while alpha side is vulnerable to this on upper respawn.

[DarkCrusade]

I will have to do some major changes to my version of Nuubiaa and follow your suggestions. Before I remove the tunnels I want to have at least some playtest at some gather server to see how it turned out really.

[Biggles]

Just no!! leave nuubia

[DarkCrusade]

Just no!! leave nuubia

Tell me why?

[Biggles]

Just no!! leave nuubia

Tell me why?

The original one looks better, nuubia does not need any visual remake, it would be the gameplay then, the alpha side does have some advantage. But don't make huge changes
And nuubia is a beauty, it's clean and perfect, in looks

[L[0ne]R]

Just no!! leave nuubia

Tell me why?

The original one looks better, nuubia does not need any visual remake, it would be the gameplay then, the alpha side does have some advantage. But don't make huge changes
And nuubia is a beauty, it's clean and perfect, in looks

Well, that is a matter of opinion. Original nuubia looks alright, but to me the remake looks decent too. I have a few concerns about the texture, but it's hard to tell from the preview, so I'll wait til the map is released.

[DarkCrusade]

Well, that is a matter of opinion. Original nuubia looks alright, but to me the remake looks decent too. I have a few concerns about the texture, but it's hard to tell from the preview, so I'll wait til the map is released.

That´s my opinion, too, I like the original Nuubia but I think it could be more pretty. What are your concerns about the texture? I already gave you a download link in the post with the big overview so you can see how it looks in game.

[L[0ne]R]

Well, that is a matter of opinion. Original nuubia looks alright, but to me the remake looks decent too. I have a few concerns about the texture, but it's hard to tell from the preview, so I'll wait til the map is released.

What are your concerns about the texture? I already gave you a download link in the post with the big overview so you can see how it looks in game.

Sorry, haven't noticed the attachment. :S
Checked out the remake, and so far it's nice, but I'm not liking the texture much. Or rather the grass part - looks kind of messy.
Also, ground looks a lot like sand and doesn't go well with grass.

Maybe you should try a few other textures and perhaps you'll find something better.

[DarkCrusade]

Sorry, haven't noticed the attachment. :S
Checked out the remake, and so far it's nice, but I'm not liking the texture much. Or rather the grass part - looks kind of messy.
Also, ground looks a lot like sand and doesn't go well with grass.

Maybe you should try a few other textures and perhaps you'll find something better.

Do you have any texture in mind that would looks better? I checked my folder already and didn´t find anything that´d suit the theme better. What about layout changes?

[As de Espada]

now you have a bravo spawn before the blue flag, and an alpha spawn after the red flag, that's unbalanced. Maybe you could update you first post.

I think you can easily lower your polycount. I'll try someday...

[L[0ne]R]

I came across a rather nice texture, which I attached to this post.
I also hope you'll add some lianas or something - remake still looks a bit empty comparing to the original (but that's just me being picky <_<). It has a plenty of bigger sceneries (like those tree BGs on left/mid/right, which IMHO look too dark and not as good as original ones), but not many smaller sceneries like bushes or lianas, so map feels a bit empty.
Not that it needs to be overloaded with sceneries, but you can even just copy/paste the ones in original nuubia and it should look fine.
 
As for layout changes - I don't like the tunnel much (it makes blue base much less safe for blue flagger), and those pillars bug me - they're distracting and not really suitable for camping since nuubia's a fast-paced map.

[zakath]

I came across a rather nice texture, which I attached to this post.
I also hope you'll add some lianas or something - remake still looks a bit empty comparing to the original (but that's just me being picky <_<). It has a plenty of bigger sceneries (like those tree BGs on left/mid/right, which IMHO look too dark and not as good as original ones), but not many smaller sceneries like bushes or lianas, so map feels a bit empty.
Not that it needs to be overloaded with sceneries, but you can even just copy/paste the ones in original nuubia and it should look fine.
 
As for layout changes - I don't like the tunnel much (it makes blue base much less safe for blue flagger), and those pillars bug me - they're distracting and not really suitable for camping since nuubia's a fast-paced map.

ahh kamikaze duck texture, my favourites however when doing textures for multitexturing and you dont wanna mess around in photoshop or similar there is this nifty tool you can use that you can find here

[Blue-ninja]

I was thinking you can actually merge different textures together using Polyworks' polygon transparency feature and then taking a screenshot of it to save as texture

[As de Espada]

paint FTW xD

[DarkCrusade]

@Loner: I don´t recommend camping on Nuubia even if those pillars are there. Also the pillars are imo too small to camp there and furthermore their opacity has been set to ~90% what´d make it hard to camp there. I´ll mess around with your attached texture and see what difference it has. I am still working on the scenery but I´ll take your suggestions about those big trees into account.

@BJ: That´s possible? Didn´t think about it but it sounds nice, but I guess Rains program is doing the job better and nicer.

@As de Espada: Well, if you want to look whether you are able to reduce the amount of polygons in this map you´ve got my accreditation On a side note: I think it´s hard to merge textures with paint like Rainraiders tool does it if you don´t want to get a phased texture.

[As de Espada]

is that story of giving the fish an teaching fishing: How to reduce polycount