Author Topic: How about cheat prevention based on trust?  (Read 1989 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline kunderez

  • Major(1)
  • Posts: 23
How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« on: May 25, 2010, 01:04:01 pm »
Hi, I am getting tired of cheaters in soldat scene...

BattlEye, despite it's good purpose, has only one notable effect on Soldat... lag spikes. IMO BattlEye integration in Soldat was just waste of time. Cheaters will allways find a way to cheat ( unless the game is programmed by a god and therefore is rock solid ).

So what I am suggesting is centralized player account server that any dedicated game server could communicate with. I know there is something like that coming in 1.5.1... but the feature I would like to see is tree-like network of player accounts.... Let me explain... you'd have to get invite in order to play Soldat and you are responsible of your actions to "upper accounts"( the players above you in the tree = the player who invited you ). If you cheat or get accused of cheating, you and all the surrounding accounts( the player who invited you, and those players that you invited ) would get negative points. Dedicated servers then could check player's reputation and then ban them if they have too much negative reputation.

I know that this sounds pretty lame at first, but when you think about that in action, you'll realize that this idea would finally force people to grow up. For example real life situation where your good friend invites you to play soldat, you'd think twice before you start to cheat because your cheating would ruin your friend's Soldat "career".

... and all good ideas are welcome ofcourse!

TY

« Last Edit: May 28, 2010, 11:40:44 am by kunderez »

Offline 10th_account

  • Soldier
  • **
  • Posts: 103
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2010, 01:43:54 pm »
Games aren't private bittorrent networks. Soldat needs all the people it can get to stay alive.

Offline L[0ne]R

  • Soldat Beta Team
  • Rainbow Warrior
  • ******
  • Posts: 2078
  • need a life. looking for donors.
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2010, 02:04:42 pm »
you'd have to get invite in order to play Soldat
I rarely say this, but this is just stupid. Sorry.



1) One reason why Soldat is awesome is because you can quickly download it, install it and start playing in a matter of a few minutes. Upcoming account system already takes some of that away, and with invite-only system you'll have to wait even (much much) longer time just to get an invite. Maybe never, because of problem #2.

2) Making it invite-only will instantly kill the flow of new players, which is already very small.
If you look through this thread: http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=36928.0
You'll see that for most people their friends don't take Soldat seriously, so even if they get an invite - they won't be interested in playing Soldat for long. Majority of Soldat players find out about this game randomly through internet, so the trees you're talking about simply won't grow. Soldat players are more like field flowers (hey, I like it! I think I'm gonna be a daisy :D ).

3) Innocent players will surely suffer because the person who invited them turned out to be a cheating noob or just an ass who got himself banned on purpose to make others suffer.

4) Since the Soldat community isn't too big, invites would be a rare thing. It's very possible that some will decide to take advantage of problem #1 and make money by selling invites (and once they're done with that - see problem #3)

5) Like you said yourself - cheaters will always find a way around. It's the same for "trust" system. I'm sure there will be those who find a way to abuse it.


BattlEye, despite it's good purpose, has only one notable effect on Soldat... lag spikes. IMO BattlEye integration in Soldat was just waste of time. Cheaters will allways find a way to cheat ( unless the game is programmed by a god and therefore is rock solid ).
If you played Soldat long before BEye was added - you should remember that without BattlEye there were hackers on servers almost every single day. After BattlEye was added - there were times when I haven't seen a single hacker in months. Yes, cheaters will always find a way to cheat, but BattlEye made it a whole hell lot harder for them.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2010, 02:13:53 pm by L[0ne]R »


L[one]R, INF veteran
maps - remakes: inf_Warehouse ; inf_Fortress ; inf_(Sun)Rise ; inf_Outpost ; inf_Abel ; inf_Moonshine

Offline pavliko

  • Soldat Beta Team
  • Camper
  • ******
  • Posts: 397
  • >‿‿◕
    • Offical TTW Community
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2010, 02:22:32 pm »
Cool! now all the noobs know the hack names....
Delete all those fucking working hack names T__T
« Last Edit: May 25, 2010, 02:35:37 pm by pavliko »
The safest thing to do is jumping out of a plane!

Offline demoniac93

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1554
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2010, 02:39:54 pm »
I think there's nothing more to add above what Loner said, this is a lose/lose situation, without BattleEye we'll see people hacking till the cows come home, but implementing this will kill whatever chances Soldat ever had of spreading out.
b&

Offline -Major-

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1419
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2010, 02:43:26 pm »
ye... good idea to ban people in a small game... (multiple ban)

if one get caught, you lose like 10 players, that's really making soldat better!
I for one wouldn't invite anyone, since that might get me banned.

Offline kunderez

  • Major(1)
  • Posts: 23
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2010, 03:05:52 pm »
Cool! now all the noobs know the hack names....
Delete all those f**king working hack names T__T
If you are worried about me providing hack names... it really wasnt that hard to find those... just google "soldat hacks" and you will find them all in a matter of minutes...

BTW all those hacks I found need stuff inserted in soldat's directory or some running cheat software... can BattleEye identify that?

Offline -Major-

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1419
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2010, 03:12:03 pm »
Cool! now all the noobs know the hack names....
Delete all those f**king working hack names T__T
If you are worried about me providing hack names... it really wasnt that hard to find those... just google "soldat hacks" and you will find them all in a matter of minutes...

BTW all those hacks I found need stuff inserted in soldat's directory or some running cheat software... can BattleEye identify that?
there is no battleEye

Offline SyavX

  • Soldat Beta Team
  • Camper
  • ******
  • Posts: 338
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2010, 03:21:17 pm »
If you are worried about me providing hack names... it really wasnt that hard to find those... just google "soldat hacks" and you will find them all in a matter of minutes...

BTW all those hacks I found need stuff inserted in soldat's directory or some running cheat software... can BattleEye identify that?

http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?action=help#hacks

Offline Furai

  • Administrator
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1906
    • TransHuman Design
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2010, 03:39:17 pm »
Cool! now all the noobs know the hack names....
Delete all those f**king working hack names T__T
If you are worried about me providing hack names... it really wasnt that hard to find those... just google "soldat hacks" and you will find them all in a matter of minutes...

BTW all those hacks I found need stuff inserted in soldat's directory or some running cheat software... can BattleEye identify that?
there is no battleEye
Link to back up Major's words. http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=38003.0
"My senses are so powerful that I can hear the blood pumping through your veins."

Offline Fireman

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 88
  • D:
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2010, 03:56:30 pm »
Hi, I am getting tired of cheaters in soldat scene...

BattlEye, despite it's good purpose, has only one notable effect on Soldat... lag spikes. IMO BattlEye integration in Soldat was just waste of time. Cheaters will allways find a way to cheat ( unless the game is programmed by a god and therefore is rock solid ).

So what I am suggesting is centralized player account server that any dedicated game server could communicate with. I know there is something like that coming in 1.5.1... but the feature I would like to see is tree-like network of player accounts.... Let me explain... you'd have to get invite in order to play Soldat and you are responsible of your actions to "upper accounts"( the players above you in the tree = the player who invited you ). If you cheat or get accused of cheating, you and all the surrounding accounts( the player who invited you, and those players that you invited ) would get negative points. Dedicated servers then could check player's reputation and then ban them if they have too much negative reputation.

I know that this sounds pretty lame at first, but when you think about that in action, you'll realize that this idea would finally force people to grow up. For example real life situation where your good friend invites you to play soldat, you'd think twice before you start to cheat because your cheating would ruin your friend's Soldat "career".

... and FYI check out this sh*t *snip* and then think about my proposal..

... and all good ideas are welcome ofcourse!

TY
Proof of said "lag spikes"? I bet it's your internet or computer. Anyways, BE doesn't work anymore so..basically your argument is invalid.

« Last Edit: May 26, 2010, 05:45:56 pm by SDFilm »

Offline Mittsu

  • Soldat Beta Team
  • Flagrunner
  • ******
  • Posts: 617
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2010, 04:11:02 pm »
Cool! now all the noobs know the hack names....
Delete all those f**king working hack names T__T
If you are worried about me providing hack names... it really wasnt that hard to find those... just google "soldat hacks" and you will find them all in a matter of minutes...

BTW all those hacks I found need stuff inserted in soldat's directory or some running cheat software... can BattleEye identify that?

yes, you couldnt use those while we had BE
Realistic-Soldat.net
<+elerok> soldat is dead
<+AThousandD> shit happens

Offline darDar

  • Soldat Beta Team
  • Flagrunner
  • ******
  • Posts: 811
    • #Soldat Gather - Community on Discord
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2010, 07:11:20 pm »
omg you are so retired..why dont you also post the downloads for tha shit hacks.. really good job to post such a site here.
Soldat Gather 'Matchmaking Community on Discord'

gather.soldat.pl

| My Maps: ctf_Pyramid, ctf_Replay, ctf_Blako, ctf_R6, ctf_Ntex, ctf_Caro, ctf_Bizar & vs_mode mappack |

Offline -Major-

  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1419
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2010, 07:19:18 pm »
ye, he's totally retired!

Offline pavliko

  • Soldat Beta Team
  • Camper
  • ******
  • Posts: 397
  • >‿‿◕
    • Offical TTW Community
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #14 on: May 26, 2010, 02:48:35 am »
If you are worried about me providing hack names... it really wasnt that hard to find those... just google "soldat hacks" and you will find them all in a matter of minutes...
And you still want noobs to find about hack on SF?
This is just wrong..
ye, he's totally retired!
failer
The safest thing to do is jumping out of a plane!

Offline echo_trail

  • Global Moderator
  • Rainbow Warrior
  • *****
  • Posts: 2222
  • ménage-à-trois
    • my last.fm
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2010, 03:19:31 am »
Sorry for being so late to take action, fellas. SD already edited the post, and I'm gonna warn kunderezfor posting hacking related material. Since it was not his intention to spread hacks, but merely to prove a point, he's not getting a ban. PM me if you feel differently towards this matter.
I fucking miss all you cunts!

Offline kunderez

  • Major(1)
  • Posts: 23
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #16 on: May 28, 2010, 11:54:25 am »
I am sorry I broke the rules but that was not the point here...

I was just trying to make conversation about how we could cope with this "cheating situation"...

Facts:
- BE costs 200€/month and it is not bullet proof
- Amount of cheaters isn't going to decrease
- Accout system could work but it would reduce playability
- Lots of people has given up on Soldat because it's bugs/cheating

Possible solutions:
- Try to collect 200€/month from current players and play amongst the remaining cheaters
- Implement account system
- Complete Soldat sourcecode refactoring
- Let the Soldat just fade away and die

So...what's going to happen?
« Last Edit: May 28, 2010, 12:03:28 pm by kunderez »

Offline Mittsu

  • Soldat Beta Team
  • Flagrunner
  • ******
  • Posts: 617
Re: How about cheat prevention based on trust?
« Reply #17 on: May 28, 2010, 12:44:50 pm »
- Amount of cheaters isn't going to decrease

the fact is BE decreased the amount of cheaters
Realistic-Soldat.net
<+elerok> soldat is dead
<+AThousandD> shit happens