dem ghosts?

[jrgp]

so VijchtiDoodah, how do you explain 2 meters of toilet paper was rolling out by itself, stopping it was easy, however, when the grip was removed it continued to roll out even detaching the paper from the roller.
are you gonna cry out "no proof!!"?

That's the kind of s**t occurrence that I don't believe in. Your toilet paper roll is probably right in the path of an air vent or something. I don't believe ghosts can touch or interact with anything physical; they're just transparent images with thoughtful faces you'll occasionally see. All that stuff about "things go bump in the night" are bullshit cliches.

[-Major-]

so VijchtiDoodah, how do you explain 2 meters of toilet paper was rolling out by itself, stopping it was easy, however, when the grip was removed it continued to roll out even detaching the paper from the roller.
are you gonna cry out "no proof!!"?

That's the kind of s**t occurrence that I don't believe in. Your toilet paper roll is probably right in the path of an air vent or something. I don't believe ghosts can touch or interact with anything physical; they're just transparent images with thoughtful faces you'll occasionally see. All that stuff about "things go bump in the night" are bulls**t cliches.

well, the stairs ran (really loud) up and down 3-4 times and then the door knocked. but that's not as good evidence, because theoretically there could be somebody running the stairs very very loudly in a house next to this. the door could actually have been some pranker.

however, the toilet paper is hard evidence.
a vent couldn't make it roll either... unless it's VERY strong air so that the scale type friction would be so large that the top would spin away (meaning, the friction on both the upper side and lower side of the paper got the same friction. however, if you use a angular thingy (place a ball under a stick, then you can get more power depending on how long each side is) then the friction could get higher on the upper side... but for 1mm to count you'd need some extreme wind power....).

obviously those things are hard to believe, even tho many report similar incidents (even some that are very much more physical). it's just denial and/or incomprehensible, which makes you not believe in it (calling stuff fake etc, even tho some I guess is fake or a missunderstanding).

[DarkCrusade]

well, the stairs ran (really loud) up and down 3-4 times and then the door knocked. but that's not as good evidence, because theoretically there could be somebody running the stairs very very loudly in a house next to this. the door could actually have been some pranker.

Checked your stuff already?

however, the toilet paper is hard evidence.
a vent couldn't make it roll either... unless it's VERY strong air so that the scale type friction would be so large that the top would spin away (meaning, the friction on both the upper side and lower side of the paper got the same friction. however, if you use a angular thingy (place a ball under a stick, then you can get more power depending on how long each side is) then the friction could get higher on the upper side... but for 1mm to count you'd need some extreme wind power....).

The ghost obviously tried telling you to refrain from using your fingers to wipe your arse. Or it's something usual like jrgp explained.. it's as easy as that.

[-Major-]

however, the toilet paper is hard evidence.
a vent couldn't make it roll either... unless it's VERY strong air so that the scale type friction would be so large that the top would spin away (meaning, the friction on both the upper side and lower side of the paper got the same friction. however, if you use a angular thingy (place a ball under a stick, then you can get more power depending on how long each side is) then the friction could get higher on the upper side... but for 1mm to count you'd need some extreme wind power....).

The ghost obviously tried telling you to refrain from using your fingers to wipe your arse. Or it's something usual like jrgp explained.. it's as easy as that.

there is no vent close to it, also, I don't have a jet engine as a vent.
I really do hope you're no older than 13.

[ValiS]

a vent couldn't make it roll either... unless it's VERY strong air so that the scale type friction would be so large that the top would spin away (meaning, the friction on both the upper side and lower side of the paper got the same friction. however, if you use a angular thingy (place a ball under a stick, then you can get more power depending on how long each side is) then the friction could get higher on the upper side... but for 1mm to count you'd need some extreme wind power....).

What is "strong air" ?
What is "scale type friction" ?
What do you mean by "friction A and friction B have the same friction" ?
 
You lost me even more completely by the "angular thingy" talk.

When the roll of paper has been used once (meaning the start of the paper is no longer glued to the roll) the paper will hang down from the roll, and when you give it a little pull and let go, the whole roll will "magically" un-roll itself, because the hanging (falling in fact) paper's small weight is enough to keep the momentum going. Really you should try that. Now it's only a matter of "what gave the initial pull ? " ..

ghosts?

You could have bumped it very slightly when turning around. Actually pretty much anything can make the roll roll. It is very unstable.. and this has actually happened to me several times, the whole roll rolling to the floor FAST. Rolling it back is a pain in the ass (pun intented) as it goes back on all crooked.

But hey, why believe in gravity (just a theory) when there's cooler stuff to believe in like ghost etc.

[-Major-]

however... the little pin the roll is on does not have the same diameter, roughly 2/3 of the rolls diameter. so for a wind to make it roll, you'd need the friction to be able to lift something like 50 grams.
there is no logical explanation for it, thus it's a super natural phenomena, which is heavily referred to as ghost.

there is no possibility to be "wind", and even if there was a possebility, there's no source for the wind. making it roll by physical contact is also impossible, mainly because it wasn't touched prior the rolling (no, I don't suffer from CIP or any similar disorders).

[ValiS]

umm.. no offence but it seems to me your reasoning is very shallow and you outright dismiss some aspects of this physical problem.

however... the little pin the roll is on does not have the same diameter, roughly 2/3 of the rolls diameter. so for a wind to make it roll, you'd need the friction to be able to lift something like 50 grams.

If the pin had the same diameter, it would actually be much harder to make the TP roll to the floor, because 1) much more contact therefore much more friction and 2) the roll would be much more stable on the pin. Why 50 grams, and why should it be LIFTED? Shifting to one side (yes, then it will begin to lift as well, but that seems more like a side-effect) would do the trick, as this gives the TP roll potential energy, and when letting go this energy wants to return the TP to its balance position - and VOILA...

there is no logical explanation for it, thus it's a super natural phenomena, which is heavily referred to as ghost.

So you are saying that naturality as such is defined by and limited to your ability of logical reasoning? Like.. if I wear a red shirt and you can't explain logically why I wear it (and not a green one) then me wearing a red shirt is a supernatural phenomenon?

there is no possibility to be "wind", and even if there was a possebility, there's no source for the wind.

Isn't that kind of a ... tautology? Anyway this sentence is not making sense.

making it roll by physical contact is also impossible, mainly because it wasn't touched prior the rolling (no, I don't suffer from CIP or any similar disorders).

BTW, wind also counts as physical contact, and wind is generated when you move around, especially in a small room such as a WC.

I really suggest you read over your post before you click "post".

[-Major-]

do you have any idea what you are talking about?

first off, if the diameter of the roll and the pin got the same, then there's obviously gonna be a wheel inside (so it would spin as easily as a cycle wheel). 2nd, there is NO WAY a vent or wind caused by a persons movement to make toilet paper roll. why don't you go and test on your own?
To make it roll, you'd need to life the bottom, to the flip to roll, because it won't glide (unless you have extreme wind power).

There is no possibility that a wind made the toilet paper to roll out, and 2ndly, there is no vent or any other thing that could cause a substantial amount of wind power.

physical contact in this context means a human would make it roll. an object wouldn't interact with the toilet paper without a person making the object interact with the toilet paper.

[Mittsu]

...because everyone knows that people are the sole source of any kind of interaction

[DarkCrusade]

Who would have expected anything else from -Major- than "do you have any idea what you are talking about?".. I have seen toilet paper doing that before, because of the opened bathroom window and the door to the balcony in my room.

[-Major-]

DC you should probably get permanently banned, your trolling isn't very successful.

There is no vent, the bathroom is in the cellar, so there are no windows.
There are no other things that would interact with the toilet paper (such as a vacuum cleaner being turned on).

[DarkCrusade]

There is no vent, the bathroom is in the cellar, so there are no windows.
There are no other things that would interact with the toilet paper (such as a vacuum cleaner being turned on).

Must I believe in ghosts now? You have no video and not even a picture, how is this a proof?

[-Major-]

no, but you could act in a manner that isn't "*closing eyes and holds for my ears screaming bullshit*".

[DarkCrusade]

It's like religion, you either believe in one or you don't. You can't beat people to believe in what you believe in (so you are actually on one level with all these stupid people from the middleage).

[Dusty]

oh wow

[Thinkto urself]

dark crusade watching you debate is like reading every pompous 12 year old internet debater opinion come together at once

everyone has heard it before and you just keep saying the same thing over and over

SCIENCE SCIENCE I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING SCIENCE SCIENCE RELIGION

[Grimbad]

Clearly, a ghost dog needs to take a dump, so it came into your bathroom and grabbed your attention, ran to the bottom of the stairs, saw you weren't following, ran back up to get you, ran back down and tapped on the door to ask to be let out. My dog would do that.

So things are moving in your house for no apparent reason. You assume that it's supernatural, then that it's sentient, then that it's a dead thing, then that it's specifically a ghost as defined by ancient superstition and modern s**tty television. Why? Why can't it be a bunch of unconnected and totally random events?

Not anything against you. I don't know if there are ghosts and I don't give a s**t, though I do doubt their existence. But people whose 'open-mindedness' allows them to ignore real science tend to all just flow into the same very specific pseudoscience. Ask anyone what they'd do if they were a ghost, I don't think anyone will answer 'go to stranger's houses and play with toilet paper'. If there are invisible things, even invisible intelligences, and this can somehow be proven, there's no reason to assume it's life beyond the grave.

Just for the record, I believe that animals have strong senses of intuition (trends of runaway pets in weeks preceding earthquakes, for example), and in some cryptids. I also believe that Ghostbusters is the best theme song ever written.

[ValiS]

first off, if the diameter of the roll and the pin got the same, then there's obviously gonna be a wheel inside (so it would spin as easily as a cycle wheel)

Yes I know what i am talking about, but i'm afraid You do not.
First off, if you want to be technical in terms, then if the diameter of the roll would be the same as the pin, the roll would not fit on the pin, so the pin's diameter HAS to be smaller. When they fit like a glove, there is MAXIMUM FRICTION, therefore MINIMUM MOVEMENT! Are you saying the laws of physics have changed overnight and nobody remembered to tell me?
Second, had you ever opened a bicycle wheel (or ANY wheel actually, besides ancient ones) or ever opened a physics book, you would know that the thing that makes a bicycle wheel spin so smooth is LUBRICATED BALL BEARINGS.. not simply a pin in a hole that fits like a glove, so your analogy was way off i'm afraid. You can test these principles very easily using random household objects for example. I strongly urge you to do so if you intend to reply to me again.

To make it roll, you'd need to life the bottom, to the flip to roll, because it won't glide (unless you have extreme wind power).

This just didn't make any sense at all, so it's hard to argue this... (which does not mean you are right)

physical contact in this context means a human would make it roll. an object wouldn't interact with the toilet paper without a person making the object interact with the toilet paper.

Replace "object" with "wind", and you are actually agreeing with what I said (in your own special way though), that you make wind, and that wind moves the paper.

But the important part is to understand that the wind your movements generate, doesn't have to move the roll itself, it only has to move the loose end that is hanging down (and this does not require extreme wind power), which in turn MAY make the whole roll starting to roll, and from that point it will rather (than slow or stop) gather momentum since the hanging paper can only get heavier (in the sense that there is more and more of it) and the roll itself gets only lighter, as more and more paper rolls off it. Its really BASIC principles IMHO.

Have you ever heard of chaos theory? You know, the stuff about SMALL changes in conditions amounting to something much bigger over time (in this case)


I don't want to be cocky or sh-t, but i DO enjoy a debate.. as long as it stays interesting. And please notice I have not said anything about ghosts not existing or existing, I just think the rolling toilet paper is not an argument in favor of them existing. As I said also, I have had this happen to me several times, its annoying as hell, but it never occurred to me to blame it on ghosts.
And think about a person seeing magnetism for the first time, crazy witchcraft... but actually just physics.

[-Major-]

lol... why would I explain to you how a wheel works? obviously I expect people to know how the mechanics work.
I count the rolls diameter as the inside (not the roll itself), if you had above a normal persons intelligence you would understand that. - I do not want to spend some extra 4-5 sentences to explain how I would measure the diameter.

a theory is a theory because it isn't proving, using a theory to rule out my theory is down right retarded.

you seem to have very little knowledge in physics, a normally intelligent person would understand that a wind still room cannot produce enough wind power to roll a toilet paper roll. The paper itself weight so little that it cannot keep forcing a speed, and will lose it's speed very quickly as the factor that started the roll disappears.
you can test this by going to your bathroom and take a toilet paper roll and pull downwards width quite some force. the roll will stop spinning after some 10-20 cm of paper has rolled out (after you have let go).

I do like debates as long as it keeps me interested. I do not enjoy debating with people like you or DC.



The ghost itself musn't be a ghost. some philosophies/theories suggest there being unlimited amount of worlds existing in the same world (every possibility), now if these other worlds could interact with the world I feel consciousness in. then the interaction or the thing/person that interact with my world would be called a ghost. probably because ghost has been used for those things for so long, that it would unofficially or officially still be called a ghost. - now, this was just an example how the word itself has very little meaning. however, your low intelligence would probably translate it as that I suggest there being unlimited of proxy worlds.

The magnetism is a semi good example, it is very fascinating but I wouldn't call it the same. because you can reproduce magnetism whenever you want, even at the time when it was unknown how it worked (by repeating the same pattern of actions that were done the first time around).

[ValiS]

lol... why would I explain to you how a wheel works? obviously I expect people to know how the mechanics work.

obviously you can´t explain how a (modern) wheel works, if you yourself don't know, which you already proved with your analogy.

I count the rolls diameter as the inside (not the roll itself), if you had above a normal persons intelligence you would understand that.

This is called a henchmen argument, and makes you look stupid.  If the roll's hole's diameter is the same as the pin's diameter, then the roll would sit very tightly on the pin and would spin poorly or only by applying force to the roll itself, since pulling the paper would make the paper tear off before making the roll spin. That was all I said.

a theory is a theory because it isn't proving, using a theory to rule out my theory is down right retarded.

You mean chaos theory?
I think you downright IGNORING an existing and PROVED theory, is a bit more retarded than me using a proved and working theory to rule out your arbitrary and UNPROVED theory. Don't you?

you seem to have very little knowledge in physics, a normally intelligent person would understand...

Now you are just insulting out of the blue. F U, i was polite to you, and this is the answer, seriously F U.

The paper itself ...

Actually there are MANY different brands of TP in the world, they differ in weight, smoothness (friction!) , how loosely they are wrapped, and also the material of the pin is an issue, if it is wood or metal, or plastic - again friction comes to play. You would have to THOROUGHLY test this situation considering ALL these variables, before you can say "There is NO WAY this can happen" like you do. Just because you can't understand something does not mean it does not exist.

I do like debates as long as it keeps me interested. I do not enjoy debating with people like you or DC.

People like WHAT?
You are the one who keeps insulting people, and does not even respect them enough to write text that is coherent and/or understandable. Seriously some of your sentences just don't make any sense..

some philosophies/theories suggest there being unlimited amount of worlds existing in the same world (every possibility), now if these other worlds could interact with the world I feel consciousness in. then the interaction or the thing/person that interact with my world would be called a ghost. probably because ghost has been used for those things for so long, that it would unofficially or officially still be called a ghost. - now, this was just an example how the word itself has very little meaning. however, your low intelligence would probably translate it as that I suggest there being unlimited of proxy worlds.

You are resorting to semantics now.. sad really. I don't care about the definition of ghost, since it means something mystical anyway. I know about the theorys of multiverses etc, its ok when scientists propose them in order to try to explain our reality, but using them for your little TP incident is just outright LAME.
Why do you prefer wild untested mystical theorys to ones that actually have proof and are ALREADY universally accepted ?

The magnetism is a semi good example, it is very fascinating but I wouldn't call it the same. because you can reproduce magnetism whenever you want, even at the time when it was unknown how it worked (by repeating the same pattern of actions that were done the first time around).

That is not really saying something, because you could also reproduce the TP unrolling, if only you knew what caused it. I would think many medieval people would be scared of magnetism and would not try to reproduce it, they would call it witchcraft, exactly the same you are doing now.