M79 and Barret Unfair?

[InK$l!n3r]

Ok. Look this is only my 6th post... im sorry... have sympathy. (this sounds kinda ridiculous and Im not pushing toward this)   
       I do think that the barret needs like an accuracy meter or something. The more you run the less amount of accuracy you have because you are tired. Flying in the air will slowly bring the meter down because you falling at a decent rate of speed.  But once you go into crouch or prone, your meter will fill faster so you have more accuracy. And keep the scope. The scope is a keeper because with this meter, it makes you more ground prone therefore using a scope is usable then flying through the air in prone and using it.

(When I thought up this im thinking what is best for everyone.)

[ArmedManiac]

umm, its called "self bink" and they already have this. Have you ever noticed the reticle getting bigger? It's less accurate then. It does lower when moving, highest when prone. I understand you are new so this is all I'm gonna say, but this is why it is balanced, self bink.

[ZWZ]

Forcing people to NOT use their favorite gun makes it unfair for them. Ever consider that? Also, you are talking about a problem that doesnt take place when you get good at the game.

I dont care that the guns are underpowered, I dont care that they are easy to kill, It's the fact that it's annoying to be killed by them, when there is no way to predict their firing patterns, and there is no warning to escape other than their presence.

I know this is tough for poor players such as yourself, so i made picture.

[Commander Kitsune]

  > 

A'ight? If you know how to use a weapon better then you should be able to beat anyone else who knows how to use their weapon good.

[Tai]

Seriously, the ruger is so annoying to be killed by. OMG BAN IT

 Seriously, papercut, if everyone like you got their way, there wouldn't be any weapons left in the game. But you're for some reason too close-minded to realize that there are a group of people for each weapon in the game for which dislike the weapon in question. You just think that it's only logical to hate on the M79 and Barret, and therefore it's "unfair".

[InK$l!n3r]

The self bink isn't enough then.. If it was, less people wouldn't use it. Barret users can still run then stop in mid air and shoot. There should be bink for falling also (just for barret). I would like to see a marksman aim a gun while in freefall. Aiming would be tough. I know soldat is a run and gun fast paced shooter with less gravity then on earth but there are very few people that can shoot with lethal accuracy in free fall like some people do in soldat. Barret should be lethal on the ground but not as much in run or in flight in my opinion. I know what bink is, just because I just joined doesn't mean I didn't play it before I joined.

[AlphaVergo]

The only problem I  have with the barret is that because this game is 2-D it is a hundred times easier to kill someone "no scoping" rarher than sniping in a 3-D game like Halo where the sniper has a million times more places his target could run off to making sniping much harder, but in this gamr there is less than a 360 degree arc for which the target to escape. That is my logic on the barret. The m79 is completley different story.

[papercut]

@ZWZ - "Forcing people to NOT use their favorite gun makes it unfair for them. Ever consider that? Also, you are talking about a problem that doesnt take place when you get good at the game."

I wanted to lower the amount by showing off this theory. If my theory were to work, there will be less barreters and m79ers. Therefore my friends and cousins would consider coming  back to play soldat again. It can cool off the frustration it hands to me and others that are annoyed by the people who use the guns as well. So why would one not want to avoid annoying people? Just dont use m79 and barret all the time and it will be all clean. Constantly using the barret or m79 should be in par with spawn killing. It is just not fun for the victims of it.

I cant, nor do I wish to force anyone to do anything.

Thanks for the picture though...

The way they kill me, is just run, jump and get to the other side of the map as fast as possible (assuming that this is CTF, since it is my favored game mode), and just point and click at each person as they pass em. Guns like autos, you actually have to spend a bit of time to kill them, by holding your aim on the person for a while to get some good shots to kill him. With a one hit kill weapon like the M79 or barret, you just point, click, and keep running.

Your picture is posing the steyr guy above the m79er, assuming that all m79ers are on the ground. It is more often than not that an m79er flies high in the air. Therefor arc becomes no issue.

@Commander K -

I dont care that the guns are underpowered, I dont care that they are easy to kill, It's the fact that it's annoying to be killed by them, when there is no way to predict their firing patterns, and there is no warning to escape other than their presence.

Thanks for the picture as well...

@Tai - "Seriously, papercut, if everyone like you got their way, there wouldn't be any weapons left in the game. But you're for some reason too close-minded to realize that there are a group of people for each weapon in the game for which dislike the weapon in question. You just think that it's only logical to hate on the M79 and Barret, and therefore it's "unfair"."

I dont want the guns to be banned!! I never said that! I'm not just targeting the m79s and barrets because they are an obvious group, I'm targeting them because they ARE frustrating to be killled by more so than any other weapon. I can't believe you look at me as close-minded and stupid and a poor player when I have to explain my terms over and over and over and over and over again. I'm sick of repeating myself when all your doing is criticizing the same exact way over and over again. YOU are the one who's closed-minded

[ArmedManiac]

Once again, flies are more attacted to honey than vinegar papercut, don't go everywhere yelling people are addicted to m79 and such if you want them to quit using it, you are going about this all wrong. This is not helping your cause, and just making a lot of people not like you.

[papercut]

@ArmedManiac - "Once again, flies are more attacted to honey than vinegar papercut, don't go everywhere yelling people are addicted to m79 and such if you want them to quit using it, you are going about this all wrong. This is not helping your cause, and just making a lot of people not like you."

Good analogy. You had me thinkin a bit there. But let's assume that human soldat players are a little more complex and less closed-minded as flies. All I want is for the people that use m79s and barrets all the time to tone down, and use other weapons every once in a while. It's your replies that get readers of this topic to take sides. If you said nothing in the first place, many would agree and and I would have been going about it correctly.

[Zamorak]

Oh, btw, there is a server option to disable weapons for a reason...

[ArmedManiac]

Most people don't only use barret and m79 anyway, except noobs. Most use many guns, especially the mp5 and steyer. The noobs are so extreme they don't even use secondaries, which is the source of the K:D ratio of most people that use the barret and m79. Next time you see someone using said guns, check their K:D, it is almost always like 7 and 18

[Tai]

Good analogy. You had me thinkin a bit there. But let's assume that human soldat players are a little more complex and less closed-minded as flies. All I want is for the people that use m79s and barrets all the time to tone down, and use other weapons every once in a while. It's your replies that get readers of this topic to take sides. If you said nothing in the first place, many would agree and and I would have been going about it correctly.

 Take sides? Most players probably already have an opinion on M79 and Barret. Why do you presume disagree with you more just because ArmedManiac said so? There's clearly some people who posted here that agree with you despite him, like Ink$l!ner.

Date Posted: November 04, 2006, 01:57:19 PM

      If you got absolutely got nothing out of that... what im trying to say is that from the beginning I had found that the barret was an overpowering weapon and I still think of it that way since I started playing. Ever since that time, the barret is last on my list of weapons to use(i doesn't mean I hate the weapon). It is a cheap gun in my opinion. Com'on people anything that lets you get see farther then anybody else and isn't a power up... is straight up unfair. Especially a one hit weapon with a scope to give you a few seconds heads up of whats going on is unfair to me.
      Here's my theory for barret users that use this gun all the time... Ok you know it's unfair but guess what... if you like to PWN unfairly you can go do that. BUT, you know it is unfair and there is nothing barret users can say to convince me or anyone else that the barret gun isn't unfair.
      My theory on the m79 is similar. You know the m79 does give you an advantage, therefore m79 lovers use it. You can go PWN PWN PWN away but guess what... its unfair to an extent.
      Im not trying to start "m79ism" or anything but there is just some key things the m79 get's away with.

• The reload for m79 is just enough time to dodge the bullets of all the other weapons so you can kill them after you opponent spends shot after shot trying to wear a m79'er down as a m79'er prances away to dodge the bullets, then m79'er kills the opponent.
• One shot kill is a one shot kill. If you can aim, you can kill. This is the case with the m79.

       
     You all know parts of this is true no matter how much you love/hate the m79 and/or barret. My final words to users of both the barret and the m79'ers is... You can be unfair but the people who do come in your path are suffering because you want to be the best in the server by overpowering. That's not what soldat is about. If you think being the best on the server is all that you want and doing it unfairly... then you need to go get a girlfriend or something to figure out what being fair is about. Just please use another gun once in a while, you may like it. Besides it's no fun to be predictable all the time.

 Ok, first of all, presuming that anyone who uses M79 or Barret often doesn't have a girlfirend are the kind of things that make people either ignore you or start using it again to show you up.
 
 Secondly, why are you presuming that people use the M79 and Barret for the sole purpose of owning a server? Now, you're stereotyping anyone who wnats to use the Barret and M79. Maybe they just want to have fun. THAT is what ArmedManiac is talking about. Either way, as said many times before, unless you shoot an M79 shot from far away, in which case you're more likely to miss, you will be mowed over by projectile users. It's amazing how some people can kill with Steyr in one clip.

[InK$l!n3r]

Whatever I give up. This is just ridiculous. I guess i'm not good at arguing or maybe i'm one in a few that thinks m79 and barrets are unfair; making reasonable arguments and ways to improve this unfairness and then people just crush the ideas and arguments and dont even give them a chance. I guess too many people like things unfair. There seems to be too many people that think it's fair and a small amount of people that think it's unfair.
People that think the m79 and barret aren't unfair just can't wait for the people that think they are unfair to slip up and make a mistake in their wordings or theory's. Com'on that's not what forums are meant for. Nobody's wrong, nobody's right, it is just suggestions to hopefully improve the game or express their feelings toward something. It's not a place to just criticize every single post that doesn't go by your beliefs.
I still think that they are a TAD unfair but then again im not 100% right. I thank people that think barrets and m79's are unfair for atleast giving suggestions.

I still think the self bink isn't enough for barret.

( I feel idiotic writing all this but very few people care anyways. I'm just nubsauce.)

The only problem I  have with the barret is that because this game is 2-D it is a hundred times easier to kill someone "no scoping" rarher than sniping in a 3-D game like Halo where the sniper has a million times more places his target could run off to making sniping much harder, but in this gamr there is less than a 360 degree arc for which the target to escape. That is my logic on the barret. The m79 is completley different story.

Nice way of perceiving it. :D

[Clawbug]

People people. Barrett has been the primary source of whining about weapons in Soldat.. umm, since 80's I think.

What should we do to extinguish this? Remove barrett, all other 1shot-1-killers aswell, including Knife, SAW, M79 and M72 LAW also.

After that? Decrease the power of other autos.

"I Dont like when I have 100% health and dude with 10% health throws nade at me, I die, IT IS NOT FAIR!!" -> Remove nades.

"Dude with 10% health can shoot better with ruger than I can with 100% health!!" -> Remove semi-autos

"Dude with 10% health has better accuracy than I do" -> Remove all existing weapons -> No killing = no fun.

The only problem I  have with the barret is that because this game is 2-D it is a hundred times easier to kill someone "no scoping" rarher than sniping in a 3-D game like Halo where the sniper has a million times more places his target could run off to making sniping much harder, but in this gamr there is less than a 360 degree arc for which the target to escape. That is my logic on the barret. The m79 is completley different story.

Im miserably sorry, but in Soldat, the barrett is not 100% accurate.
When I face an enemy, I move my mouse over him, while hoding the fire-button down, and the cursor is not on him, sniper line is not on him, but still I hit him.

I dont know how does it work, I have just learnt to deal with it.

BTW: You can not be good as an assault-barretard if you are using sniper line.



Get the skill to kill, and be happy.

[ArmedManiac]

I barely even use the barret anymore, I use mp5 and saw because they are more fun, and I still say they are fair. They don't kill me any more or easier than the other guns, and if they do it is more from me not paying attention than lack the skill. And like clawbug said, it has been argued about forever, something would have been done if it is so unfair. It is not even that great of a weapon, the autos and semis are better anyway. They are not unfair, next time you play start running as fast as you can(this means the running jump thing) and fire and see how accurate is is compared to where your cursor is.

[papercut]

@Zamorak - I dont make servers. I join other peoples. I dont have the patience for people to come in my servers and go "what no barret/m79?"

<Major has left the game.>

@ArmedManiac - I've been noticing that more and more lately. I am very glad to see that. But there is still like a third of people that still ONY use m79 and barret.

but again:

I dont care that the guns are underpowered, I dont care that they are easy to kill, It's the fact that it's annoying to be killed by them, when there is no way to predict their firing patterns, and there is no warning to escape other than their presence.

@Tai -  "Take sides? Most players probably already have an opinion on M79 and Barret."

I'm talkin about taking sides against me. Ever since you made your first post in this topic you got about 3 people to agree with you. I hope you know that your just prolonging this argument just for the sake of arguing. You know I'm not asking for much. Especially since last time i played soldat you werent even using barret or m79. So I'm not even speaking directly to you.


"Secondly, why are you presuming that people use the M79 and Barret for the sole purpose of owning a server?"
Because if they didnt want to own a server, theyd use the hardest weapon to use like a chainsaw or a minigun. (duh)

"Now, you're stereotyping anyone who wnats to use the Barret and M79. Maybe they just want to have fun."
I've made the point earlier that the gun is frustrating to be killed by. It adds to the fun of the user, but takes away from the victim. Not cool. If I am wrong in that sense then no one would have ever complained about the m79 and barret in the first place.

@Clawbug - I'm not saying we kick out the weapons. I'm just saying, because MM wouldn't want me begging that we replace cheap guns with fair ones, that the people who constantly use them, should have to tone down a bit and start using other weapons. Because the goal of Soldat is to have fun. However its not cool if you are hoarding the fun for yourself.

Anyone who continues to rebel against such a simple act that can benefit us all, is just making a mockery of themselves. Not picking barret and m79 every time is NOT THAT BIG OF A DEAL. If you do it, I'll appreciate you more. People that hate m79s and barrets will appreciate you more. Dont use the barrets and m79s for the same reason you dont TK people or spawn kill or camp. It's not that hard to do, and it wont piss anyone off. I don't know how many times i have to tell you guys that, but I hope you comprehend it soon.

[ArmedManiac]

Than tell this to the Major (6) that doesn't even know there are forums, your preaching to the wrong choir,  and besides, you take my fun if you kill me with any gun, not just the barret and m79, for the billionth time, it is personal choice, I hate being binked to death when I am using any gun, everyone has the thing they hate, don't go trying to impose your beliefs on everyone.

[papercut]

If you can come up with any reason why equality, and avoiding pissing people off is wrong, then I will continue my arguing further. Otherwise, I don't care about any of your stupid comments.

Until then... Your wrong.

[jettlarue]

Papercut, m79 is one of easiest weapons to dodge. Use it for a little bit then switch back to your other weapons, I guarantee you will be better at dodging. Until you do that noone cares. Also do the same for barret. It has barely any arc...wooo we found a weakness.