M79 and Barret Unfair?

[papercut]

(I originally posted this at soldatmods.tk. please read all before ****ting flames all over my head.)

M79/Barret "unfair" Theory
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I know there are quite a bit of people who quit playing soldat by the abundance of m79s and barrets being selected all the time. Many people say that it is unfair, though they aren't able to back it up. I'm here to attempt to prove that those guns are unfair.

Now I'm going to be honest. I never use M79 or Barret because I feel that the most "Pro" way of playing soldat, is to use the weapons that are the hardest to kill people with, not the easiest. That's one reason why I request that people dont use those weapons. I don't particularly hate people who use the M79 or barret, but it still frustrates me when players dont vary their weapon selection at all (Those who use barret or m79 ALL THE TIME). I am just showing off this in hopes that people who quit soldat will soon come back to play it again.

So this is how the M79 and barret are unfair. Unlike the other weapons, Barret and M79 provide a simple point-and-click method to kill people instantly without melee combat.

Let's use this example:
Danko and Dangerous Dave are playing a DM. Danko and Dangerous Dave are both using Mp5s. They both manage to catch each other at the same time and start spraying bullets at each other. Danko manages to get out alive leaving Dangerous Dave in the dust. Danko is down to 15% health meaning that hes not going to have much luck at all killing his next opponent.

After some kills back and forth, Dagerous Dave is now using the trusty Barret and Danko is still using the Mp5, and they are both at 100% health. Danko and Dangerous Dave both see each other at the same time again. Dangerous Dave is able to blast Danko with the barret at the same time Danko was about to shoot. Danko is dead at 0% health, while Dangerous Dave is at 100%. this 100% health gives Dangerous Dave the oppurtunity to pull off that exact act again, giving him the same easy possibility to get kills.

A barret or M79 user is able to quickly take out their enemies without the horror of getting shot. However, if two people were to use other weapons, (like desert eagles, steyr, ak74, etc) the person who dies is still able to knock off most of his opponent's health. (Which evidently, is a lot more relieving than getting killed with your enemy still at 100%) The only thing making a barret or m79 user vulnerable is their imperfect aiming. Missing with a barret or an m79 can be very devastating. However an experienced soldat player could use his barret or m79 and get direct shots 9/10 times. Which obviously, is really frustrating to his victims.

I hope M79 and Barret users take a look at this, stop being so selfish by at least giving their opponents a chance of killing them to make soldat more enjoyable to play for everyone. i hope you all consider how fun this game is for the people you play with, and not just how fun it is to yourself. You can do this by simply varying your weapon choices, theres already 14 to pick from!

[Nfsjunkie91]

The only weapon I hate playing against is the M79, but even then it's nto that bad. Also, the Barret is just fine as it is, and we don't need people being sympathetic to players who can't dodge snipers.

This probably should be in weapon balance.

[Commander Kitsune]

Which is why you bink the hell out of Barreters. And about m79 if you aren't smart enough to keep your distance (and I use Mp5) then I don't know what to tell you.

[Ajnin Ezakimak]

Please learn, Soldat isn't 1v1.  -.-

[Mr. Domino]

After some kills back and forth, Dagerous Dave is now using the trusty Barret and Danko is still using the Mp5, and they are both at 100% health. Danko and Dangerous Dave both see each other at the same time again. Dangerous Dave is able to blast Danko with the barret at the same time Danko was about to shoot. Danko is dead at 0% health, while Dangerous Dave is at 100%. this 100% health gives Dangerous Dave the oppurtunity to pull off that exact act again, giving him the same easy possibility to get kills.

He deserves to get slaughtered for using a close range weapon against a long range one. The only thing I'd agree with is that those weapons do dictate what you need to select to be effective against them. Running into Desert Eagles, AKs, etc. really doesn't have the same effect because of the lack of the instant kill. I think that's what makes them off balance somewhat.

[O.R.I.O.N.]

DON'T TOUCH MY BARRET!   The M79 and Barret are hardly unfair.  Each weapon has a certain counter to them, I.E., M-79 is useless at long range, and Barret is useless at short range.  Hence, the term "unfair" just doesn't do justice.

[Frenchie]

I agree with ORION. the m79 and barret are not unfair. It's just it takes a whole different tactic to bring players using them down.

I don't want to sound up myself or sound like the 1337357 soldat player
But I use to use the m79 all the time, and in every game it was pretty easy (coming in top3)
Since 2 days ago I decided to perm switch to ruger and still its very easy (coming top 3). And with the ruger I'm able to bring down m79's from far away (they never get a chance to shoot me) and barret's its equally easy as they easily miss if move around quickly.

Most people in the server change there weapon choice to match others. Too often I have seen a whole server full of m79's and barret's but it takes only one person owning with an auto - or semi to make the whole server (lol) change to different weapons

[sniping_dreamer]

The M79 and Barret are hardly unfair.  Each weapon has a certain counter to them, I.E., M-79 is useless at long range, and Barret is useless at short range.

Barret useless in short range?Ummm...no? Sure,it's not the ideal short-range weapon,but it's not useless in short range.Many times I get kills with Barret when I'm about 3 feet away.

[Sethamundo]

Please learn, Soldat isn't 1v1.  -.-

Not only that, don't base this off of bots. Players learn to anticipate moves and dodge.

[scg_912]

I agree with u on the Barret but not the M97 because people have horrible aim with that so it doesnt phase me

[SpaceMonk3y]

Yea, that is so true.
All these ppl who are mad because they are loosing or because they just want an easy win use these weapons just for an easy, unfair advantage over the others.  I am not saying that I think that the berret and M79 should be taken out of ther arsenal, I'm just sayin that ppl should stop using them for unfair advantages and to start using the whole aray of the arsenal.  I personally like the secondary wepons.

-SpaceMonk3y

P.S. Do u know anything about demos?

Date Posted: October 17, 2006, 05:57:49 PM Quote from O.R.I.O.N.
Hence, the term "unfair" just doesn't do justice.

I believe that ORION's last sentence is completely benine.
How can u say that the Barret is useless for short range.
I mean, u gotta b f***in kidding me, the Barret kills in 1 shot  no matter where u hit the other player.  As does the m79.  If u aim both of these 2 good enough u can take out any body within the bullets range, not the sight's range before fired, the bullets range!  This completely contradicts your statement.  I think u should think this issue over again.

-SpaceMonk3y

[Commander Kitsune]

First of all, you spelt "benign" wrong XD (I really needed to point that out).

Second. why is everyone still complaining about barret/m79?
SIMPLE SOLUTION

Barret: go prone under a collider
M79: Get the hell away

Simple? Yes?

[papercut]

Nfsjunkie - most people who use those guns are new nonetheless, but i have played some of the people ive played years back and they still use the m79 or barret and of course at this point they are above advanced with it, and being killed by them is far more frustrating than being killed by those who are very skilled with an AK for a steyr

Commander K - binking the hell out of barreters rearely works because when they prone in the air (typical for almost any barret user) it increases their accuracy very much. And I can definetly dodge m79s every now and then, however it they are still frustrating to be killed by

Ajnin - of course soldat isnt always 1v1, that was just my example. However it is rare that all the players collide all at once.

Mr. Domino - It's not like Dangerous Dave told Danko he was going to use a barret (duh)

ORION+Frenchie - Maybe unfair wasnt the best word to use, but note this:

"using desert eagles, or ak74, or steyr, the person who dies is still able to knock off most of the opponents health (which evidently is a lot more relieving than dying with your opponent still at 100% health.)"

I guess what I am trying to point out is that for whatever reason, I find it to be a lot less annoying when I can predict my death (seeing the bullets hit my guy, seeing my health drain away).

This may also be why youtube.com has so many videos of people breaking their computers playing counterstrike - because dying in counterstrike is so unexpected and unpredictable, it can make people want to break something.

One hit kill weapons are just not fun to get killed by.

[Mr. Domino]

Second. why is everyone still complaining about barret/m79?
SIMPLE SOLUTION

Barret: go prone under a collider
M79: Get the hell away

Simple? Yes?

Yep, I find Barret only annoying when killed from long range before you have much chance to react. When a Barret user appears on screen, it's hardly impossible to anticipate and dodge the shot. Know that it'll take about 1.5 seconds for the shot to come out and be ready to backflip, prone and fly, etc. to avoid it.

I'd suggest playing !Elite Snipe & Slice. I hated using the Barret up until frequenting that server. It'll make you understand how to use it and its limitations. When you have people sawing you to death after a missed shot, you'll see how helpless the Barret can be. It always helps to know how to use all weapons to understand what works and what doesn't. If you're playing with the HK and find yourself getting slaughtered by Ruger users from a distance, understand that the weapon has an advantage at that range and is hardly because some overpowered game breaking weapon.

M79 is easy. Just keep your distance and don't charge about the map like an idiot where you're susceptible to M79, knife, saw, Barret, etc. deaths.

[F3nyx]

The Barrett is useless at close-to-medium range, as long as its target has the brains to bink it.  If the enemy team is Barrett-whoring, grab an automatic and go to town.

People who constantly get slaughtered by the M79 need to examine their playing style.  Everyone loves to charge around and go for point-blank shots, but you simply cannot afford to trade point-blank shots with an M79.  You'll get 'sploded.

Hang back, keep your distance, pick your shots, and they will fall.  Don't let yourself get suckered into tight enclosed spaces that give the M79 user an advantage.  Over-aggressiveness leaves bits of your flaming carcass lying all over the map.

Try, instead, suckering them into taking a difficult shot.  Hover invitingly, then do a prone-jet as they fire.  Now you've got 2 seconds to tear into them, which should be enough... but if you can't finish them off, retreat and try again!  It's all about patience.

[Ajnin Ezakimak]

I know you know that Soldat isn't 1v1.  But what is the point of your demonstration?  You might as well say Spaz owns because it rocks at close range.

It's situational.  1 hit kills rule if no one else is around, but if they have a scrap of teamwork, their effiency drops dramatically.

Abuse their weaknesses.  Learn how to make some distance inbetween you and the M79er.  Spray constantly to bink that Barreter.

[cr4sh]

So this is how the M79 and Barret are unfair. Unlike the other weapons, Barret and M79 provide a simple point-and-click method to kill people instantly without melee combat.

not so anymore, M79's are hard to use against good dodgers and have a curve to the shot.  They're also rather slow traveling bullets.  Barets have a small start up time to help the imbalance.  Autos bink the aim of a sniper.

A Barret or M79 user is able to quickly take out their enemies without the horror of getting shot.

That's the point of the weapon.  The victim is also responsible for not adjusting his playing style (ie: taking cover, worming and such) to the weapon. It's not unfair.  When you think about it it's a great strategy.

Sure, we all get frustrated when we get killed by them, but it's no reason to hate the weapon.  They are actually fun to use just like all the other guns.

I agree they are overused, but it's impossible to stop the abusers

[Zamorak]

Lol, adapt to the situation.

[Cato269]

People never seem to relise that the minigun is in the game for a reason. use it

All weapons have a counter weapon. minigun trumps sniper the easiest.

[Mr. Domino]

All weapons have a counter weapon. minigun trumps sniper the easiest.

I disagree. The minigun's startup time allows the Barret to fire the shot, and the selfbink creates an unnatural cone shaped firing pattern which makes it difficult to target the enemy. The minigun should be the answer, but it's really not. Better to use the Minimi.