inf_Undermines

[Suowarrior]

A month back then Spiltcoffee suggested inf_Undermine for a default map, cos map being popular in public servers. However map looked very low leveled, so remake had to be made. So here we go inf_Undermines.



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[DarkCrusade]

I like this map, but those vent covers ... well, there´s still enough time to fix it.

[Biggles]

Voted yes, played it in a 3v3, was quite fun, though it seems like it's impossible to cap it really isn't

[Poop]

If we follow what you posted in The highlands thread, this map is basically very similiar to fortress. However, I personally don't care, its another popular map in pubs and is very fun, and I think fun maps should be added to default.

[Suowarrior]

Yes it's having basically the same similiarty: you must defend the flag place from multiple directions. So yes it's similiar with Fortress and Industrial. However that vent scenery in front of players gives it new fun tactical possibilities.

If you guys want it, take it. If not, I won't be in your way.

[Horve]

Let me teach you a better technique at shading the rocky parts without turning them into softies, like in the overview over there. You can do this after you have coloured and shaded everything. You select the black colour and the colour pasting tool, which pretty much colours a whole polygon in one click. You set the opacity to 10% and start clicking randomly on the rocks. You will achieve the "good old default" look. The interior of the complex is unacceptably bland. Same goes for the the texture of the building, it is one of the more flegmatic textures available. No cigar.

[Keron Cyst]

I have stickied this since it's an ongoing poll about a map being considered for default status.

[As de Espada]

I can still say that the vents's shadows could follow the house's light, or maybe a better pattern. They seem random.

[L[0ne]R]

Hm. I think this map needs more than just visual upgrade. Even though it's fun as it is, there's still a number of layout flaws:

~ too much flagcamp and very little tactic
~ lots of nade-thru-floor bug abuse
~ spawnkilling issues on red base
~ lots of useless/unused spots

As for visuals, my only concerns are:
- The vents
- The blue base's background is too dark and almost blends with map's background. Creates a weird feeling.. :S
Original map was brighter, while this one is a bit bland and boring (I'm mostly referring to polygons. Sceneries are fine). Saturate polygon colors a bit and add more green?

As for layout changes, here's a few ton more ideas:

[Suowarrior]

~ too much flagcamp and very little tactic
~ lots of nade-thru-floor bug abuse
~ spawnkilling issues on red base
~ lots of useless/unused spots

As for visuals, my only concerns are:
- The vents
- The blue base's background is too dark and almost blends with map's background. Creates a weird feeling.. :S

I agree that there's very little tactic, except camping behind the vent scenery. I guess that's the fun part. Preventing flag (area) camp happening, at least one of the main routes, so that defenders would have a clue where the enemies are going to attack and they could go halfway against them. If there are 3 routes in 3 different directions, there's nothing but sit and wait.

I've planned setting flag spawn in different position, mainly for reason that bravo could return it easier, but it also would prevent that spawnkill happening, though spawnkill is really nothing, since enemy can't do it repeatedly there and it's stypid tactic in any case.

Bluebase's bg was supposed to be very similiar with current bg. Less distraction, more fun.

Your ideas make it easier for alpha, when I'm trying to do it easier for bravo :S.

[L[0ne]R]

Your ideas make it easier for alpha, when I'm trying to do it easier for bravo :S.

Well, it depends. Some things do become easier for alpha, but that's only if blue team flagcamps. If they take better positions further away from flag - it should give blue team some advantages against red team too. At least that's the way I see it.

Also, I think it already is rather easy for blue team to return flag (especially if left route is shorter and right route a little longer) because if blues take left route - they usually have enough time to intercept flagger coming from other routes.

[Suowarrior]

Well, it depends. Some things do become easier for alpha, but that's only if blue team flagcamps. If they take better positions further away from flag - it should give blue team some advantages against red team too. At least that's the way I see it.

I agree on making left route shorter. At the moment it's the least used attack route, but main route for defender to catch the flagger. So that way it should help bravo.

Adding only player collides into bravo base might be good idea. Not sure about placing but having opc at the roof of flag area/under vent seems reasonable.

[L[0ne]R]

Adding only player collides into bravo base might be good idea. Not sure about placing but having opc at the roof of flag area/under vent seems reasonable.

In case of only-player-collide polys I didn't give it much thought, so it's a very rough idea.

I hope you also noticed that on that pic I also deleted the left wall in flag room. That should do part of the job of making flag room vulnerable and make it easier to get in and out of top vent.

[Suowarrior]

I'm not motivated to try fix issues with alpha prefering balance or any else fixes as I got belief that they don't work out. However I'd be happy if someone could do things that I see are impossible. Feel free to modify map if you like.

[scarface09]

Hm. I think this map needs more than just visual upgrade. Even though it's fun as it is, there's still a number of layout flaws:

~ too much flagcamp and very little tactic
~ lots of nade-thru-floor bug abuse
~ spawnkilling issues on red base
~ lots of useless/unused spots

As for visuals, my only concerns are:
- The vents
- The blue base's background is too dark and almost blends with map's background. Creates a weird feeling.. :S
Original map was brighter, while this one is a bit bland and boring (I'm mostly referring to polygons. Sceneries are fine). Saturate polygon colors a bit and add more green?

As for layout changes, here's a few ton more ideas:

Yeah...change the map to something like this! Whoever is planning to modify it.

[SpiltCoffee]

Also, I think it already is rather easy for blue team to return flag (especially if left route is shorter and right route a little longer) because if blues take left route - they usually have enough time to intercept flagger coming from other routes.

I find this to be a good thing, because on the current version, too, you get situations where you and bravo will be arriving at alpha's flag at the same time, similar to what happens on inf_Fortress.

The thing it has over inf_Fortress, though, is that Bravo would have a much harder time trying to camp the white flag waiting for Alpha to try and cap, so it forces them to actually be proactive in defending it, and with all routes having pretty much the same time from bravo's base to the white flag, defenders can go down any route to pursue the flagger (so Alpha has to actually protect (!) the flagger, or not get any points)

[Swompie]

I've played this map a few times on No Mercy already, the first thing I've noticed, when the EFC is once out of the bravo base, it's almost impossible to return the flag, later I noticed that the map is pretty campy in these ventilation shafts, aswell the whole bravo base. Ok, Inf means bravo should camp, but that makes this game pretty boring then, I want more action in this map.

[SpiltCoffee]

when the EFC is once out of the bravo base, it's almost impossible to return the flag

Is bravo even attempting to try and chase the flagger? If they hit one of the three tunnels at the same time the flagger hits another, you should intercept them on the white flag (so don't snail!).

[Swompie]

when the EFC is once out of the bravo base, it's almost impossible to return the flag

Is bravo even attempting to try and chase the flagger? If they hit one of the three tunnels at the same time the flagger hits another, you should intercept them on the white flag (so don't snail!).

Never really looked, but all the time respawned alpha players came and shoot me down