Author Topic: INF_SunRise (aka Rise remake)  (Read 17035 times)

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Offline L[0ne]R

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INF_SunRise (aka Rise remake)
« on: November 23, 2009, 12:05:16 pm »
----------- Description:
This is a remake of INF_Rise, a great map originally made by chakapoko maker. I thought the new name would suit it better than just adding "remake" at the end.


----------- Changes:
v1.5
- Fixed critical bug with background sceneries.
- Replaced some polygon pillars with sceneries.
- A few polybugs fixed.
- Other minor changes.

v1.3
- Removed Blue spawn in mid-air.
- Slightly increased the probability of Blues spawning on roof (same chance as Reds spawning on left route)
- Added regen poly in the truck.
- Repositioned spawns near the truck.
- Repositioned bonus kit spawns.
- Replaced more PNG sceneries with BMPs (total number of PNGs in inf_SunRise is down to 11).
- Removed a few semi-transparent polys in BMP version that I missed in previous version.
- Significantly improved shading in BMP-only version.
- Stretched textures.
- Fixed polybugs.
*added 1.5-compatible versions to the archive.

v1.2.1
- Added a slight orange tint to background sceneries in BMP-only version.
- Fixed a few sceneries that were hidden behind other sceneries.

v1.2
- Made lower route more "inescapable" by making it more steep (however it's not completely impossible).
- 1 new Blue spawn in the air on the right side.
- 2 new Red spawns on the left route.
- 3 new Red spawns near the truck.
- 1 new medkit spawn at top-left.
- Stack of crates below flag are now a big collider.
- Added invisible walls on left and right side and a death poly at the bottom.
- Major changes to the top-left part of the map:



PLEASE READ:
I know some of you are thinking "wtf is that at top left change it back!!11!!oneone", but before furiously hating this map - please, give it a thorough testing first. If you think those changes were a bad idea - make sure to give a good explanation why, and make sure it's not part of your imagination, but a result of actual testing with real people. Those who just don't like changes of any kind - please refrain from commenting at all.

My opinion:
I think it should prevent cheap M79 caps which often occurred in the original. Since left side now has more red spawns - it is especially important to make left route harder. Also, I think the current structure is more interesting and involves a bit more teamwork and interesting tactics.



v1.1
- Reduced number of PNG sceneries from crapload to 35 (most of which are clouds).
- Made changes to left route (see Changes.jpg)
- Made water 100% opaque
- Made pillars on left route more transparent.
- Added another blue spawn to 2nd floor.
- Added a red spawn on left route, where blue spawn used to be.
- Other minor tweaks and changes.

v1.0
This time it's more than just a visual rework. I also did some re-balancing in red team's favor. Some of the more significant changes to balance are shown here:


In addition to that:
- Red team's spawn should now be spawncamp-proof.
- Map boundaries should now be further away - that means teleport edges to the left and right are a little bit farther.
- Map "ceiling" too is now higher. You can now safely jet straight up on the roof til fuel runs out (nade and m79 jumps are still a bad idea though).
- Other minor changes and tweaking.

* Alternative route to flag is one-way. There's not enough jet fuel to fly back up. However with a nade/m79, really good timing and some luck it is possible to get back up.

----------- Previews:
Original:


Rework (bmp-only version):


Rework (full-quality):





"maps" folder contains 2 files:
inf_Rise_rm.PMS - a bmp-only version with no PNGs or semi-transparent polygons to meet default map requirements.
inf_SunRise.PMS - a full-quality version with a few semi-transparent polygons and some PNG sceneries.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2010, 09:10:37 pm by L[0ne]R »


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Offline legendslavi

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2009, 07:54:50 pm »
Nice job loner! I made a few tweaks to Rise as well (finally figured out how polyworks..works) :)

http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=36669.0


Won't the new alternative route to the flag be easy for blue to snipe (as the red players turns the cliff)?
Maybe instead of a red spawn at the top of the map, it could be in middle the scafolding (where blue used to spawn). This way, red isn't right next to the flag, but is close enough to get up there using jets (no need for m79 everytime).
« Last Edit: November 23, 2009, 08:02:57 pm by legendslavi »
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Offline duz

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2009, 08:03:47 pm »
Wow! Nice job!
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Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2009, 08:27:58 pm »
Nice job loner! I made a few tweaks to Rise as well (finally figured out how polyworks..works) :)

http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=36669.0


Won't the new alternative route to the flag be easy for blue to snipe (as the red players turns the cliff)?
Maybe instead of a red spawn at the top of the map, it could be in middle the scafolding (where blue used to spawn). This way, red isn't right next to the flag, but is close enough to get up there using jets (no need for m79 everytime).
Yes, it'll be a problem to get to alt. route from the main (1st floor above ground) path, but you can take out the sniper from the middle path (2nd floor) and go straight to alt. route.
Either way it's better than one route. :P

Also, there's no red spawn at the top. Your idea with the spawn on scaffolding sounds interesting, but I don't want to mess with the balance even more. I increased jet fuel a bit, so getting up shouldn't be as hard. M79 is not the only way to get to roof after all. :P

It's nice that you figured out how to use polyworks. Hoping to see more maps from you. :)


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Offline Crimson Goth

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2009, 01:03:01 am »
My only complaint is the new route. Just another area for bravo to defend thus making the map easier for alpha.

Offline smiluu

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2009, 02:42:55 am »
And my complaint is those background walls and thingys.
I know it's supposed to have more realistic looking. I understand if you insist to stay in this realistic look
since its a big f**king deal now, but those just doesn't fit inf_Rise in my opinion.

Lowroute is good idea, but it would be so much better if it was more like.. "unnaturally" straight path.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2009, 02:44:46 am by smiluu »

Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2009, 01:18:23 pm »
My only complaint is the new route. Just another area for bravo to defend thus making the map easier for alpha.
Well, it is a bit too hard for alpha to get to black flag, especially if half the blue team camps right in the flag room. The 2nd route is meant to give red team more advantage in that lower area.
Defending lower route IMO isn't necessary - both routes to flag can be defended from the same spot.

And my complaint is those background walls and thingys.
I know it's supposed to have more realistic looking. I understand if you insist to stay in this realistic look
since its a big f**king deal now, but those just doesn't fit inf_Rise in my opinion.

Lowroute is good idea, but it would be so much better if it was more like.. "unnaturally" straight path.
Dunno about background walls. I really like when maps have "outside" and "inside" areas, and backgrounds really help to achieve that. Otherwise it feels a bit weird. :S

The low route is so cave-like to provide some cover for both sides, in case one of the blues decides to camp there, so I don't want barrett campers to have too much advantage. Though I kinda like how you showed it on the picture, so if more people won't be happy with low route's structure - I'll try to make it more like you showed there.


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Offline smiluu

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2009, 02:09:09 pm »
blues decides to camp there, so I don't want barrett campers to have too much advantage.
Well to be honest it is practically completely useless path, it will be really hard escape route since there
will mostly likely be a rain of bravos when alpha tries to fly out there. But INF is known of its useless and fun paths huaha

Also, it would be a bunch of stupid bravos if they were to camp there. They can block the way with good advantage, but same time it's disadvantage for flag's safety. If one team member camps there it's like a lack of defense. So basically, according to your theory... (text continues in picture)
« Last Edit: November 26, 2009, 02:10:42 pm by smiluu »

Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2009, 06:00:55 pm »
blues decides to camp there, so I don't want barrett campers to have too much advantage.
Well to be honest it is practically completely useless path, it will be really hard escape route since there
will mostly likely be a rain of bravos when alpha tries to fly out there. But INF is known of its useless and fun paths huaha

Also, it would be a bunch of stupid bravos if they were to camp there. They can block the way with good advantage, but same time it's disadvantage for flag's safety. If one team member camps there it's like a lack of defense. So basically, according to your theory... (text continues in picture)

Eh, you can't really use it as an escape route, because there's not enough jet fuel to fly back up, and nade boosts are tricky.
I can't know for sure how useful/useless this route is because there's nowhere I can test this map. On #soldat.mapping maybe, but they dont play inf there too often, and I lag there. :/
« Last Edit: November 26, 2009, 06:23:56 pm by L[0ne]R »


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Offline SpiltCoffee

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2009, 04:11:41 am »
Now THAT is a decent remake. Especially the extra route, definitely needed. In the current version, if all of Bravo just camps the flag room, Alpha is screwed, so the extra path may make it a better map for at least getting the flag.

Eh, you can't really use it as an escape route, because there's not enough jet fuel to fly back up, and nade boosts are tricky.
I bet there is if you use a Spas!
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Offline STM1993

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2009, 04:17:05 am »
Not every player is going to use the Spas though.

I like this remake, but I believe that it is still too biased towards Bravo, even with that extra route, which I don't find to be that useful at all. The flag area that Bravo camps around is just very near the extra route and can block it off extremely easily, not to mention Bravo has an advantage in height and there's the issue of players deliberately jumping off the two edges of the map.

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2009, 08:36:26 pm »


Why can I see my player? That waterhole area was a good place to hide. I think you should make it opaque again.
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Offline As de Espada

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #12 on: November 29, 2009, 09:10:21 pm »
make it opaque only where you can hide, in front of the other poly you can leave as it is, or you put a middle scenery with a wall look in there, so you can hide and the water will be the same
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Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #13 on: December 01, 2009, 06:45:40 pm »
Updated to 1.1 with major FPS optimisations. Changed most PNG sceneries to BMP and made an extra-fugly version specially for default maplist.

Not every player is going to use the Spas though.

I like this remake, but I believe that it is still too biased towards Bravo, even with that extra route, which I don't find to be that useful at all. The flag area that Bravo camps around is just very near the extra route and can block it off extremely easily, not to mention Bravo has an advantage in height and there's the issue of players deliberately jumping off the two edges of the map.
Well, I can't really think of any other measures that would help Alpha. I added another spawn to 2nd floor which reduces the chance of blue players spawning on roof.
I also moved the map boundaries a bit farther. You can still jump off the edges but it'll take longer to reach them than in the original. This map might still be a bit hard for Alpha, but hopefully much easier than before.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2009, 07:19:12 pm by L[0ne]R »


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Offline Cake

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #14 on: December 01, 2009, 08:20:44 pm »
For the lower route:
[Attachment 1:] If possible, you might want to make that one polygon an ice polygon.
[Attachment 2:] The spas is a bit easy to get up with, so perhaps rise that polygon a bit..?
[Attachment 3:] The m79 works okay here.. :p
[Demos to show what the hell I am talking about.. :P]

Just my comments after playing the map.
Nice map.



Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #15 on: December 02, 2009, 04:00:40 pm »
Quoted from here.
Updated inf_SunRise to 1.1 with major FPS optimisations. Changed most PNG sceneries to BMP and made an extra-fugly version specially for default maplist. It has no PNGs or semi-transparent polygons, so hopefully it meets all the requirements.

http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=36727.0

I should probably say this in the maps thread, but make custom sceneries for the inside of the building so they can still have lighting. Just because it's all .bmp's doesn't mean it has to be ugly.
It's really hard to make lighting without PNG sceneries, and I really don't want to work on this map anymore. :S
I think even BMP-only version doesn't look too bad. Not as bad as the original at least. If only it was ok to use at least 1 png - I'd just add the shading scenery back. D:


For the lower route:
[Attachment 1:] If possible, you might want to make that one polygon an ice polygon.
[Attachment 2:] The spas is a bit easy to get up with, so perhaps rise that polygon a bit..?
[Attachment 3:] The m79 works okay here.. :p
[Demos to show what the hell I am talking about.. :P]

Just my comments after playing the map.
Nice map.
1) Couldn't run the demo, because Soldat said demo isn't compatible with my version. :/ Could you please post a screenshot instead?
2) Well, as long as it's not M79 it's good, I think. Whatever encourages players to use something other than M79. Besides, if you boost there with spas - you're left with no ammo and very vulnerable to the enemy.
3) Couldn't run the demo, but I just tested that left ledge again and yeah.. piece of cake. :/ I'll fix that later, when more things are reported.

Thanks for the feedback. :]
« Last Edit: December 02, 2009, 04:04:45 pm by L[0ne]R »


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Offline Cake

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #16 on: December 02, 2009, 07:11:16 pm »
For the lower route:
[Attachment 1:] If possible, you might want to make that one polygon an ice polygon.
[Attachment 2:] The spas is a bit easy to get up with, so perhaps rise that polygon a bit..?
[Attachment 3:] The m79 works okay here.. :p
[Demos to show what the hell I am talking about.. :P]

Just my comments after playing the map.
Nice map.
Quote
1) Couldn't run the demo, because Soldat said demo isn't compatible with my version. :/ Could you please post a screenshot instead?
2) Well, as long as it's not M79 it's good, I think. Whatever encourages players to use something other than M79. Besides, if you boost there with spas - you're left with no ammo and very vulnerable to the enemy.
3) Couldn't run the demo, but I just tested that left ledge again and yeah.. piece of cake. :/ I'll fix that later, when more things are reported.

Thanks for the feedback. :]

Screenshot: http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/7109/sunrise.png
Not sure if it was intended but you can rest/refuel your jet there and fly up..



Offline Crimson Goth

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #17 on: December 03, 2009, 01:17:27 am »
The map would be good without the extra route...

Offline zakath

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #18 on: December 03, 2009, 05:47:21 am »
finally took a closer look on the map, anyways you should be aware that corridor3 is bugged.
It looks something like this for me and for many others:

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Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: INF_SunRise (aka Rise reworked)
« Reply #19 on: December 03, 2009, 02:54:46 pm »
The map would be good without the extra route...
You can't know for sure. :/
If 2+ good players camp at flag - reds are pretty screwed (yes, it doesn't happen all the time but it still happens). Whether new route is good idea or not - only extensive testing with a lot of players will show. And that isn't exactly happening. :S

finally took a closer look on the map, anyways you should be aware that corridor3 is bugged.
I had a similar problem, but it was almost unnoticeable and was easy to hide. I guess it shows up differently for different people. :/ Must be the way Photoshop compressed it.
I'll update the sceneries in the next version (probably today or tomorrow).
« Last Edit: December 03, 2009, 02:58:47 pm by L[0ne]R »


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