Supine position

[%%%%%%%]

Of course you CAN always ignore all the pesky details and just do that, and it will work, just look really weird and make no sense 

Cheers.

1. It'd look fine and make as much sense as it does now for crouching.
2. "Of course you CAN always ignore all the pesky details"? Yeah, let's just imply that I'm doing that and effectively put words in my mouth. Good idea, but don't stop there; also sprinkle in some hyperbole with a few absolute words. That'll fool 'em.
I mean, it's not like it was an extra feature that I brainstormed and simply said wasn't necessary. Oh, wait, that's exactly what it was.

Honestly, you're really stretching your prejudice far, so much so that it's not even close to sensible nor constructive anymore.

I get it: you don't like the idea (thus far, for no actual reason); it's apparent there's nothing I can say to dissuade you, so I'm not going bother.
Naysayers will naysay, and sometimes they do it in a fallacious, subtly condescending, and patronizing manner.

"Cheers."

[BKT]

Care to try drawing a stick figure of how this supposed to look? Crouching and looking down make sense. Supine and looking down (without leaning to the side) doesn't, unless you have your back and torso in the upright position and leg stretch horizontally, which then wouldn't be 'surpine position' and look stupid.

[%%%%%%%]

Nah, I might as well draw a circle for you, 'cause there'd be no point.

[DarkCrusade]

Just turn the gostek 90° from the position when you are jumping up and looking down and it's done. /thread

[L[0ne]R]

Or turn the prone position upside down.

[BKT]

Nah, I might as well draw a circle for you, 'cause there'd be no point.

I didn't elaborate my position about the gameplay bacause I drop that point of argument and stop mentioning it, so I'll assume the same for you. Very well then.

[DarkCrusade]

*yawn* interesting banter you two. Might as well cast a vote and see if anyone actually wants a feature like this, doable or not.

[%%%%%%%]

Whether it's wanted is a valid concern, but there's no question it's doable. I simply urge those that are against it to not be prejudice and withhold their final stance until they try it. I mean, it's bewildering to me why we wouldn't at least try it out/test it before giving judgement.
It's like what Akinaro said in another thread about how the old player base doesn't like change; his was in context of maps and graphics, but it rings true for gameplay as well, it seems. As an ironic aside, last I knew, he himself wasn't a fan of this idea.
 
I personally think it'd be a hit; if we start testing it and it doesn't work out, then we just won't add it to the game. Simple as that; no harm, no foul.

Who knows, though; maybe I'm just too close to the idea and presenting it in a bad way. Or maybe I'm a bad proponent and my defense of it is attracting more animosity than support.

[raiden1231]

It is never a considered feature dated back in 2007. It kind of ruins the simplicity of soldat.
http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=19833.msg229127#msg229127

[%%%%%%%]

http://forums.soldat.pl/index.php?topic=19833.msg229127#msg229127

Wow, thanks for that link. So it's not a new suggestion and, when suggested before, was a huge hit with the community; almost all of them thought it was a good idea.
Apparently the forum community was much more open and positive back then.

I mean, the idea is the exact same, even to what key to use. Wow.

[Akinaro]

And again there is difference between initial wow effect, and thorough rethink about it with taking in to the account how exactly it should work and how it would affect other movements and gameplay.
Its not about openness and positive community, but about looking at it in wider perspective instead on focusing on your own preferences.


Its the same situation like with Depth of field blur effect on modern games.
Idea is good, and its look amazing on screenshoots... but when you play, its annoying when you want to look at something and you need to wave your cursor just to remove this blur, and for most of time this blur is too strong or not visible at all...

The same is here: beside initial WOW effect, and cool position for screenshoot, I can bet on my dog, my car and my wallet that at first people would use it for fun and then forget about it and not use it at all. And maybe 1-2% of people would try to use it, but everytime its gonna be hit and miss because soldat is too dynamic for such matrix movement that where made for slomo effect.

[%%%%%%%]

I can bet on my dog, my car and my wallet that at first people would use it for fun and then forget about it and not use it at all.

I'll take that bet, if it gets implemented.

I might let you keep your dog, though.

[Akinaro]

my dog is annoying, my wallet is empty an my car is a bit crappy :]

[BKT]

... What do you expect people to react to you, %%%%%%%, when you presenting your idea like it was such an extraordinary idea that nobody could ever thought of before; so good, in fact, that "there's literally no reason to not add this" and must be implement immediatly because, according to you, it's so obvious that it would be no hassle at all to add it in.

[Akinaro]

And its not like no one would like to have new movements.

For example I would love to see movement/animation when Gostek doesnt have gun in hand or have one handed gun, it could "hang" on wall like it would hold it, but only on corner of polygon. It could still shoot but aim would be worst and it would fall of after few sec.

Or kicking enemy to the ground after gaining some speed and hitting some key(like "C") It still would be hit and miss to match speed and moment to hit the key, so it would not be like everyone would kick them self everytime. Or instead of kicking him on ground you could kick his gun. And this movement could start some fighting mods and scripts so soldat could gain some new vibe to it.


There is loots ideas like that, but why for example Im not insisting to make it now?
Because hanging movement would mess a bit climb maps and it would be hard to implement and set polygon properties(because it would be hard to calculate when you can hang on polygon because of its size and closeness of other polygons)
And fly kick movement? It would be hard to set good speed to enable it and it could be messy after people would practice a bit with it, so everyone would kick them self... even if its sound fun...

[%%%%%%%]

%%%%%%%, when you presenting your idea like it was such an extraordinary idea that nobody could ever thought of before

What the hell are you even talking about; it's like you're just looking to start trouble now
Since when did I ever say it was some genius idea that no one else could've ever thought of
In fact, I said the -exact opposite- and said that it was something that should've been included in the inception of the game (like another poster said in that older thread on the same suggestion), along with prone position, obviously implying that someone else should've thought of it before.

Don't put words in my mouth, BKT

[%%%%%%%]

And its not like no one would like to have new movements.

For example I would love to see movement/animation when Gostek doesnt have gun in hand or have one handed gun, it could "hang" on wall like it would hold it, but only on corner of polygon. It could still shoot but aim would be worst and it would fall of after few sec.

Or kicking enemy to the ground after gaining some speed and hitting some key(like "C") It still would be hit and miss to match speed and moment to hit the key, so it would not be like everyone would kick them self everytime. Or instead of kicking him on ground you could kick his gun. And this movement could start some fighting mods and scripts so soldat could gain some new vibe to it.


There is loots ideas like that, but why for example Im not insisting to make it now?
Because hanging movement would mess a bit climb maps and it would be hard to implement and set polygon properties(because it would be hard to calculate when you can hang on polygon because of its size and closeness of other polygons)
And fly kick movement? It would be hard to set good speed to enable it and it could be messy after people would practice a bit with it, so everyone would kick them self... even if its sound fun...

What's your argument here, Akinaro
That, because a couple of moves that are truly more unique and harder to implement to the game than supine position (which is just an inverted prone) might not have much practicality/benefit or might mess up other game modes, other new moves (read: supine) shouldn't be implemented?

Why not make a separate forum thread in Suggestions for each one and allow people to judge those moves individually,
instead of grouping them together and turning it into a red herring/straw man argument in the supine suggestion thread

[BKT]

Since when did I ever say it was some genius idea that no one else could've ever thought of

I never said you did.

[Akinaro]

Jesus Christ. You bashing BKT for what you actually doing.
 You behave like this supine position is your own child and you need to protect it with your own life and no matter of what you need to say that is amazing and needed. No it's not needed. It's just fancy position that have no real benefits in sold at game.

As I said before look at in in more wider perspective than your own nose. And ask yourself why it was not implemented ? Because it's useless if you think about it longer. There is initial woe effect of how cool it is but then if you have brain you realize that its cool only on screen shoots or games that have bullet time or are not that dynamic like sold at where typical match is a brutal chaos.

And my point about mentioned movements?
Point is, that Im trying to think about it before start whining that it need to be implemented. There is lots of nice ideas for soldat but half of them are hard to implement and are not priority and other beside cool look are useless in every way... Just like this supine position.

[%%%%%%%]

%%%%%%%, when you presenting your idea like it was such an extraordinary idea that nobody could ever thought of before

Since when did I ever say it was some genius idea that no one else could've ever thought of

I never said you did.

You implied it; don't be pedantic.