Poll

Do you like current state of the development?

Yes
5 (10.4%)
No
43 (89.6%)

Total Members Voted: 48

Author Topic: Do you like current state of the development?  (Read 2251 times)

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Offline Nedi

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Do you like current state of the development?
« on: January 27, 2018, 05:12:49 pm »
He said I shouldn't let the negative 0.1% of the community bring me down.

I am just curious how many people we have in soldat right now. The number of negative votes multiply by 1000 and voila.


Offline Ekscalibur

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2018, 05:46:33 pm »
Hmm interesting topic but let me warn you , the topic suddenly might get closed.

Offline Nedi

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2018, 05:59:17 pm »
Yeah, please no negative comments here. This thread is only for statistical purposes.

Offline koooka

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2018, 06:02:46 pm »
so we have at least 11000 players, wow

Offline machina

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2018, 07:21:31 pm »
Well, we could get an actual number of players by counting all unique IPs those have requested a server list for last 4 weeks. This should give an accurate player count.

Also, note that everyone who gives a shit about Soldat is actually on this forums and pops in frequently enough. Then, the result of this poll is foreseeable. One could also assume that every active player (i.e. from these who play Soldat but don't log in to forums) who didn't cast a vote here sees Soldat's development okay.

TL;DR get no. of votes saying "no" and divide it by the no. of active players (jrgp could manage it if really wanted to) and you get your percentage answer accurately.

Still, if it was 0.1% (that was randomly told by Shoozza/MM), we would require 15000 players at the very moment which is a lot xD I bet there's like 200-300 unique players a month.

Offline Moroes

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2018, 04:16:09 am »
I can see it fluctuating and stabilizing at 0.1% later. All the polls indicate such result.

Code: [Select]
strawpoll.me/14916771
strawpoll.me/14798942

Offline Akinaro

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2018, 05:51:55 am »
Dont forget that not much players even know about this forum or they just dont visit it. Its a matter of going to any server or other site and ask to get some additional statistics. Then you will get really nice opinions from people who actually still play this game :]
« Last Edit: January 28, 2018, 05:55:20 am by Akinaro »

Offline Ygrek Starmagedon

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2018, 10:52:46 am »
I'm playing Soldat on multiplayer for about 7 years and there were only 2 things that really changed : graphics and the amount of players...

Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2018, 04:00:59 pm »
I don't like the current state of development either, but the main question is - what are the other options? I can't think of anything realistic. Maybe giving Shoozza less shit for work he's not required to do and gets nothing in return for, to take off some of the pressure, bring back some of his passion and motivation. But at this point I wouldn't even call that realistic. Too much damage is already done.


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Offline Nedi

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2018, 04:17:52 pm »
I don't like the current state of development either, but the main question is - what are the other options?

Making soldat open source.

Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2018, 09:01:01 pm »
I don't like the current state of development either, but the main question is - what are the other options?

Making soldat open source.

Which is already planned, i.e. it's "current state of development".


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Offline urraka

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2018, 11:36:35 pm »
I don't like the current state of development either, but the main question is - what are the other options?

Making soldat open source.

Which is already planned, i.e. it's "current state of development".

Planned for like 8 years... The current state of development is that little and nothing is getting done. Or why do you think there are no devlog updates or any sort of reports on progress?. As for what other options are there, they could start by acknowledging that there is a problem. Shoozza either has no enough time or no motivation to work on Soldat. I urge him to correct me if I'm wrong. More active people is needed on the programming side and as we stand there are barriers in contributing. You have to reach them out requesting to let you in and sign some license agreement, if they judge you to be worthy enough to join the team. Nobody is likely to do that if all they want is to get a glance at the code and see if they can make some changes here and there, fix this or that. It takes some sense of commitment to go that far. Then there's the fact that it's not your game so you're not really free to make changes as you like. Everything has to go through the lead dev's opinion and he (or MM) will have the final word. You're not free to share builds with other people so whatever changes you make will have to wait forever until there is an official release. And there's always that odd sour feeling that you're working for free on a closed proprietary project, with no freedom for doing with it as you please. Soldat has been maintained almost exclusively by the community for years now (Shoozza is included here). It's past time we had it released as open source. Helloer did everything that was required for the code to be able to go open source, from a legal point of view. So what is the excuse to keep delaying it? "After steam" they promised, but how long do we really have to wait for that?. So these are the options I see: 1) Continue as now and nothing happens for an undetermined amount of time. 2) Open source it and let it take off like a bird. Freedom and hope!
urraka

Offline Nedi

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2018, 02:15:38 am »
I don't like the current state of development either, but the main question is - what are the other options?

Making soldat open source.

Which is already planned, i.e. it's "current state of development".

It is. But when will it happen? As helloer has mentioned in the other thread, Shoozza had told him it wouldn't get open sourced before we have an anti cheat and I believe everyone knows what that does mean. Noone is going to make it for free in a closed project and one man can't do everything alone in a reasonable amount of time like PerroAZUL has said.

Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2018, 02:12:37 pm »
It is. But when will it happen? As helloer has mentioned in the other thread, Shoozza had told him it wouldn't get open sourced before we have an anti cheat and I believe everyone knows what that does mean. Noone is going to make it for free in a closed project and one man can't do everything alone in a reasonable amount of time like PerroAZUL has said.

AFAIK open-sourcing was planned right after the Steam release, no mention about mandatory anti-cheat. Correct me if I'm wrong on that (ideally with a link to the source comment).

Planned for like 8 years... The current state of development is that little and nothing is getting done. Or why do you think there are no devlog updates or any sort of reports on progress?. As for what other options are there, they could start by acknowledging that there is a problem. Shoozza either has no enough time or no motivation to work on Soldat. I urge him to correct me if I'm wrong. More active people is needed on the programming side and as we stand there are barriers in contributing. You have to reach them out requesting to let you in and sign some license agreement, if they judge you to be worthy enough to join the team. Nobody is likely to do that if all they want is to get a glance at the code and see if they can make some changes here and there, fix this or that. It takes some sense of commitment to go that far. Then there's the fact that it's not your game so you're not really free to make changes as you like. Everything has to go through the lead dev's opinion and he (or MM) will have the final word. You're not free to share builds with other people so whatever changes you make will have to wait forever until there is an official release. And there's always that odd sour feeling that you're working for free on a closed proprietary project, with no freedom for doing with it as you please. Soldat has been maintained almost exclusively by the community for years now (Shoozza is included here). It's past time we had it released as open source. Helloer did everything that was required for the code to be able to go open source, from a legal point of view. So what is the excuse to keep delaying it? "After steam" they promised, but how long do we really have to wait for that?. So these are the options I see: 1) Continue as now and nothing happens for an undetermined amount of time. 2) Open source it and let it take off like a bird. Freedom and hope!

There will never be "freedom to do as you please", it still won't be "your game". You still need the approval of the rest of the Soldat community (which is known to viciously disagree on a lot of things), which will be even harder without a leader. Either someone will still need to maintain some sort of control over Soldat to keep it from becoming an incoherent mess, or it may become an incoherent mess, if not malware.

Nobody knows for a fact that it will "take off like a bird". Open-sourcing will only eliminate some of the barriers (while also introducing new challenges), but there's plenty of others that will remain.

"After steam" they promised, but how long do we really have to wait for that?

Personally, I'd give it another couple of weeks. Even with a solid dev team the delays aren't uncommon. If it's still not on Steam by then - then I agree, just make the source public and let it take its course.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2018, 02:17:29 pm by L[0ne]R »


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Offline Nedi

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2018, 03:05:26 pm »
It is. But when will it happen? As helloer has mentioned in the other thread, Shoozza had told him it wouldn't get open sourced before we have an anti cheat and I believe everyone knows what that does mean. Noone is going to make it for free in a closed project and one man can't do everything alone in a reasonable amount of time like PerroAZUL has said.

AFAIK open-sourcing was planned right after the Steam release, no mention about mandatory anti-cheat. Correct me if I'm wrong on that (ideally with a link to the source comment).

AFAIK Steam release was planned on 21.12, over 1 month ago and we still don't have any information about what has been already done during that delay and how long we have to wait more. And also we were promised Soldat would get released in January. Guess what? It was a lie... again. Postponed again but this time without any official information.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2018, 06:33:26 pm by Nedi »

Offline machina

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2018, 03:36:27 pm »
we were promised Soldat would get released in January. Quess what? It was a lie... again. Postponed again but this time without any official information.
Who said it's postponed from January? There was no such official information confirmed on this forums by anyone responsible for Soldat.

Offline L[0ne]R

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #16 on: January 29, 2018, 03:44:08 pm »
AFAIK Steam release was planned on 21.12, over 1 month ago and we still don't have any information about what has been already done during that delay and how long we have to wait more. And also we were promised Soldat would get released in January. Quess what? It was a lie... again. Postponed again but this time without any official information.

No amount of complaining is going to change that for the better, but it is changing it for the worse. Constant drama and pressure from the community is one of the main reasons why there's no "official information". Shoozza certainly is far from perfect in having such thin skin, but community's response isn't part of the solution either. You either help do the work, or you deal with it, wait quietly and try to not be part of the problem.

we were promised Soldat would get released in January. Quess what? It was a lie... again. Postponed again but this time without any official information.
Who said it's postponed from January? There was no such official information confirmed on this forums by anyone responsible for Soldat.

Nothing official was announced, but considering we only have 3 days left (if you include today) - it's not unreasonable to assume the release won't happen in January.


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Offline Moroes

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #17 on: January 29, 2018, 04:04:07 pm »
The steam release was delayed to (end of) January but considering progress on my part and on the trailer/art I wouldn't necessary bet on it :/
I'm currently struggling to open up enough quality free time to make development progress in a pace that doesn't disappoint me and everyone else.

That's pretty official, not the exact date but it kinda says that the January release isn't going to happen and AFAIK there haven't been any changes done to the steam page since May 2017 or so. Idk how's the trailer thing but MM hasn't posted anything about it.
People have been quiet all those years without posting so-called dramas. Now they just feel that the game might've really suffered from poor development. But yea, it's just 0,1% of players, no big deal.

Offline Nedi

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2018, 04:51:00 pm »
No amount of complaining is going to change that for the better, but it is changing it for the worse. Constant drama and pressure from the community is one of the main reasons why there's no "official information". Shoozza certainly is far from perfect in having such thin skin, but community's response isn't part of the solution either. You either help do the work, or you deal with it, wait quietly and try to not be part of the problem.

In fact there wasn't any "drama" until december. We have been waiting quietly for the big release but nothing has happened. Also according to your answer we should accept the problem rather than discuss it. Right?

Moreover, if he once says he will be doing devlogs weekly and then he doesn't write them for 2 months while having a rough deadline it feels like he stopped working, doesn't it? And when the only developer stops working, people start looking for alternatives. Is it bad, we want soldat to be a great game?

If that's such a big deal for Shoozza, I can write devlogs every week. He just needs to tell me what he had done. I'll spend these 10 minutes per week.

Offline Akinaro

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Re: Do you like current state of the development?
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2018, 03:09:41 am »
No amount of complaining is going to change that for the better, but it is changing it for the worse. Constant drama and pressure from the community is one of the main reasons why there's no "official information". Shoozza certainly is far from perfect in having such thin skin, but community's response isn't part of the solution either.
There is no official informations because development of Soldat is a mess. This "Drama" is response of that not reason.

MM and all devs had years to prepare proper methods of developing Soldat, they years to fix and prepare Soldat for major changes. Dont put that failure on player shoulders, it was not our fault.
It was fault of MM for pissing on his own work that literally put him where he is now, it was his fault for not looking up properly on state of game for all those years, and it was Shoozza fault, because he was main dev for most of that time.
Even spaghetti soldat code cant be excuse for lazy development because we talk here about years of work. Soldat players in this time literally finished schools, got families, create their own things even if they work in the same time. So no one should even mentioned that in that period of time it could not be fixed.

Also stop calling it drama, its called reality.


You either help do the work, or you deal with it, wait quietly and try to not be part of the problem.
People wanted to help for years, and for past years you had tons of people, ideas, arts, maps, graphics, scripts, concepts and help suggestions. So tell me how the hell "you help do the work" if for all those years none was used, and dev team was constantly rotating the same people over and over, and it was never proper team, it was just bunch of friends who do random stuff in random time = no planing and proper development at all.


Also dont you dear tell all those people to "wait quietly". They waited for years. They waited, they where patient but now when there is maybe 50 people lefts no one give a crap about being polite. You screwed = you need to deal with it.

Who said it's postponed from January? There was no such official information confirmed on this forums by anyone responsible for Soldat.
Here.

The steam release was delayed to (end of) January but considering progress on my part and on the trailer/art I wouldn't necessary bet on it :/
I'm currently struggling to open up enough quality free time to make development progress in a pace that doesn't disappoint me and everyone else.


And yes, it was only suggested date, but its perfectly show how bad current development look: There is just one guy who do the work, and pseudo team behind him that talk a lot but dont do anything and MM behind the wall laughing his as off. Yes its not 100% Shoozza fault, but he and MM are responsible for all those delays, blocking other people help and ideas and they are responsible for lack of progress for all those years. If Im wrong and there is some third ""Dark Mysterious Villain"" pulling the strings and blocking Soldat development for all those years, please enlighten us about it.

Also one of reason of delayed release is lack of trailer/art?
Why?
Because none of them say what they really want. Soldat lost his chance to use community to help long time ago, but you can still get "some help" as far as you say what you need.
No one from remaining people here gonna spend time creating 100 versions of trailers or graphics and wait if devs choose something from it.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 03:13:36 am by Akinaro »